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ChemicallyInert

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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When did it become impolite to gift people cash?

14 replies

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korybing

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ChemicallyInert: I enjoy gift cards more than cash not because one seems more \"personal\" than another, but because gift cards feel more like gifts. With cash I always feel like I have to save it and I'll feel guilty if I spend it on something nice for myself (like, you know, a gift), but gift cards take that guilt away and I can happily buy that dumb book I've wanted for the past few months.

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mommiest

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ChemicallyInert: Just call it the \"Universal Gift Card.\"

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doctor_cos wants you to remain calm

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@mommiest: I have been calling it that for a while.
And it's easy to re-gift as well!

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TCama

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ChemicallyInert: In this particular instance, cash wouldn't really do the trick. The point of the money in this instance is to buy ebooks for the device. Obviously, a gift card won't do it. But with cash, you'd have to deposit it in a bank account and pay with a debit card.

The whole point is that a gift card can have a purpose to it, or at least moreso than cash. If I gave you an ebook reader and a gift card from the store that sells ebooks for that device, I'm pretty sure you'd get the point.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@TCama: That's silly. Money is fungible - provided you have a float, the actual piece of cash you spend on what you like doesn't have to be the same identical piece that granny gave you - it's cash in, cash out and a nice thank you letter.

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XTC46

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ChemicallyInert: My Parents get me giftcards when they want me to spend the money on something specific. When I was younger, I worked a lot to pay all my bills and for school and stuff and didnt have much extra cash, and they knew, if they gave me cash, I would pay bills with it or something. So they would give me gift cards to force me to go enjoy myself.

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tbax929

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ChemicallyInert:
It's not. And if any of you are given the gift of cash and feel offended by it, please feel free to forward it to me!

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Alys Brangwin can't stop the beat

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ChemicallyInert: When did \"gift\" become a verb?

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catastrophegirl chooses not to fly

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@Alys Brangwin can't stop the beat: perhaps it's derived from the verb 'regift' which applies primarily to the sole fruitcake in the universe as it is passed from person to person for eternity?

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Englishee Teacher

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@Alys Brangwin can't stop the beat: That's what I was wondering myself.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@Alys Brangwin can't stop the beat: When language dared to evolve.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@Dafrety: you mean \"devolve\", right? The 'Inkpot Word' era was an evolution. Using verbs as nouns because all those extra words in the verb phrase are just so gosh darn clunky to type out with one's thumbs? Not so much.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ChemicallyInert: It gives the impression of being more thoughtful than cash by suggesting the recipient use it for something specific, i.e. clothing from their favorite store, or food from their favorite restaurant, or in this case, books for their new electronic doodad.

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G.O.B.: Come on!

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ChemicallyInert: \"Unlike barbarians who gift cash, I went through the trouble of picking up a worthless piece of plastic that is no better than cash and is in fact more limited. Enjoy.\"

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ChemicallyInert:

It hasn't.

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HannahK

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Thanks for the heads up! I am am not a \"member\" at Barnes and Noble because at $25 a year, I don't usually buy enough books to make the 10% discount worth it. As I was browsing B&N's website yesterday, I realized that it would be worth it to sign up for the membership just for the 10% savings on the nook- until I noticed that all the nook accessories explicitly state that the membership discount can not be used on them. I couldn't find the same message about the nook itself, but I assume if you can't use the discount on the accessories, you can't use it on the device. I'm disappointed that the nook isn't integrating seamlessly with the rest of Barnes and Noble- I thought it was going to be a better answer to the logistical problems with the Kindle. The jury is still out on whether I will order one.

7 replies

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pecan 3.14159265

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@HannahK1012: The real benefit to the $25 membership (I've been a member for three years) is not the 10% off - it's the coupons for an extra 10%, 20% or even 25% off you get at least twice a month, and those are generally only applicable to members. I've saved as much as $15 before just from combining my discount with the online prices and the coupons.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@pecan 3.14159265: Exactly. Also I don't go into B&N that often, but when I do, I tend to spend a boatload, so it helps me save there, especially in addition to the email coupons and mailed ones.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@HannahK1012: I don't see why all of this is a problem because the only advantage owning an eBook reader has is that you can stuff thousands of book titles on it and carry them all with you at once. On the other hand, the eBook reader costs 10 times more than a book and then you still have to buy books at almost full cost! The eBook reader has an OK display but a book is more readable. The eBook reader is a specialized piece of gear to carry around with its accessories. Then you don't actually have rights of first sale with the \"books\" that you buy. You aren't free to do anything with the content. I can see absolutely no practical reason for owning an eBook reader at all. Buy an eePC. It's about the same cost, about the same size, and isn't crippled like a reader. I guess I just don't get the whole Kindle/Nook thing.

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jaymec

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@vastrightwing: Its all in the backlighting. I can't read on a computer for long without getting a headache. I can read on a non-backlit Kindle. Incidently, I've gotten well over $100 in free books on the kindle (not including public domain books) through various offers and that last book I purchased was Superfreakonomics which was considerably cheaper at 9.99 than it was at its typical HC price.

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Dave

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@HannahK1012: My insider info (employee fiancée) confirms you cannot use a member discount for purchasing a Nook device or any accessories.

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suzy-q

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@Dave: As another employee, confirmed. We don't get employee discounts on them either.

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coren

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@HannahK1012: Call and ask, and I do believe the discount will work on ebooks, but I rarely pay attention to ebooks so I may be very wrong. But I reiterate call and ask - the worst they can do is say no.

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notovny

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Yeah, I ran across this when I realized I'd missed the launch of Terry Pratchett's \"Unseen Academicals\" back in october. I was all ready to use two Barnes & Noble Gift Cards I'd owned to buy the book for my ipod touch on October 21, only to run headlong into the fact that a) Barnes and Noble Gift Cards could not be used to purchase eBooks, and b) there was no sort of e-book credit available. I presume it's probably because their DRM encrypts the credit card number into the book.

Thie text on this page, however, has been there at least since the 21st.

\"Gift Cards or Gift Certificates cannot currently be used towards an eBook purchase. Please check back for updates.\"

[www.barnesandnoble.com]

2 replies

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@notovny: The CC# is the excuse B&N appears to be using, but it's not true. eReader, who invented the DRM scheme a decade ago when they were called Peanut Press has been issuing and accepting gift certificates forever. B&N could do this, but they have chosen not to.

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catastrophegirl chooses not to fly

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@notovny: unseen academicals was fantastic!

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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I strongly suggest the OP go get a refund on their gift card then, if it was sold under false promises of the store. If nothing else, being in the store and being loud about how much their system sucks will eventually get the refund just to get them out of there.

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lCraesHarbor

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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What's really weird is that Fictionwise.com, the ebook site Barnes and Noble bought a while back, issues and accepts gift certificates.

1 replies

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@lCraesHarbor: And eReader.com, who invented the DRM scheme B&N uses (and are also now owned by B&N) also accepts gift certificates. It's also a load of nonsense that B&N hasn't integrated Fictionwise and eReader accounts into their system. But that's an entirely different complaint.

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dirigibleplum

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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I'm a BN employee, and Corporate is working on fixing things. No one knew of the glitch until the nook was launched, and now everyone is making angry faces at the programmers who screw up on a regular basis.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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As a B&N bookseller, I can attest we are all just as out of the loop on some of these details as the public. Despite the announcements that the 40,000 booksellers would be happy and ready to assist customers with nook, the flow of information to booksellers has left much to be desired.

1) Yes, Gift cards are currently not able to pay for nook or eBooks. This is obviously a major glitch that they are \"working on\", and is most likely a software complication between the gift cards and the ebookstore. We assume that gift cards will be able to purchase nook and accessories once there is significant enough nook to stock it in store and check out using the registers. But we have NO CONFIRMATION of that, and honestly no one will know until we have them in hand.

2) Employees should know these details as there is an Intranet page updated with FAQs on an almost daily basis with that they should be reading and discussing with the managers at daily shift meetings. However this detail was not publicized at launch, probably because it has been an issue since the eBooks launched months ago. But since eBooks was more of a bn.com service it was not understood by the vast majority of booksellers. And with all the secrecy surrounding nook they had no reason to know about eBooks.

3) The OP should call the store, preferably on Monday (as the store manager will almost definitely be there for meetings and conference calls), ask for the store manager and discuss the situation. They should be willing to refund the gift card and if not ask for the District Manager's phone number. Or you can always the EECB (firstinitial lastname @ bn.com -- CEO Steve Riggio sriggio@bn.com)

4) As a commenter said, there is no discount on nook for members, institutions, teachers, employees, anyone. It's $259 for and and everyone at this time. Who know where the future holds but the wording on our coupons has already been modified to exclude nook and nook accessories, so that's not a promising sign.

5) FWIW, the item is nook. No capital letters, no articles (ie not Nook, not \"a nook\" or \"the nook\"), it's simply... nook. Don't ask me why, just know we get corrected on the spot if heard calling it \"a nook\"

Hope this helps clear up a little confusion. It's a rocky road and in order to keep it a SURPRISE they had to keep all of us booksellers in the dark up until launch day so we're constantly playing catchup and many booksellers know less than the customers that come into the store.

They're still promising demo units in all stores at the end of the month, and I would wait until you can touch one in person to determine what to do, but with the \"overwhelming demand\" pushing back shipping dates by then it may be too late to order for holidays... oh wait I forgot, nook is not available to purchase as a gift.

*shrug*

5 replies

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PsiCop

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@DigitalMariner: I wasn't aware that even the mighty Barnes & Noble had the authority to prevent people from modifying a noun with an article. But I guess they do. Silly me ... thinking that the conventions of English grammar apply across the board ... !

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@PsiCop: See, but it's not a noun, it's a proper name. Think of it as being named \"steve\" or \"bob.\" You wouldn't say \"I'm going to dinner with a steve tonight,\" would you?

(I'm aware that this is ridiculous and I also hate this particular marketing convention, I'm just pointing out their logic.)

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PsiCop

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@kerry: I see where you're going ... but B&N insists it can't be capitalized, which means they're saying it's NOT a proper noun.

If only we could do something about these pretentious language-slashing marketing types ... e.g. the people who think it's a good idea to misspell stuff (e.g. \"Blu-Ray\" instead of what it should be, \"Blue-Ray\") based on the principle that correctly-spelled words can't be trademarked. Which is of course totally untrue.

Language tricks like this are juvenile ... and I mean that literally. Purposeful misspellings and playing games with punctuation are things that little kids do. Grown adults know better.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@PsiCop: I think whether you capitalize a proper noun, particularly a name, is up to the owner of said name. Nobody would argue that e. e. cummings is not a proper noun, and yet we do not capitalize the letters in the name, because that is how he chose to write it.

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PsiCop

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@kerry: Actually his name was and remains \"E. E. Cummings.\" The lowercase version of his name was a brief affectation inspired by his lack of using capitalization and punctuation in some of his poems. It is, unfortunately for those who like that sort of thing, completely unofficial. All major references to the man ... such as you'll find here ... list his name as \"E.E. Cummings,\" which is what it should be. The bottom line is that he did not get a vote as to whether or not his name should be capitalized. No one does. Not even \"K.D. Lang\" ... who uses a similar schtick as her \"stage name\" (probably inspired by the myth that E.E. Cummings successfully changed his name to \"e.e. cummings\" -- as I explained, though, this is not the case).

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HannahK

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@DigitalMariner:
LOL how are you supposed to talk about it in a sentence? \"My boyfriend got me nook for Christmas!\" It sounds ridiculous. I hate when they do things like that.

Thanks for all the info.

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David in Brasil

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@HannahK1012: I cannot wait to go into a store to ask for \"nookie\".

That's just how I roll...

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@David in Brasil: \"(ie not Nook, not \"a nook\" or \"the nook\")\"

Between moronic marketing talk and the English Language, I'm pretty sure English wins every time.

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lim

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@HannahK1012: I think we should get out the stickers, markers and correction fluid to correct this on all packaging.

And now I've got the one act play \"This is a Test\" on my mind and am repeating \"This is a Nook.\" \"A what?\" \"A Nook.\" \"A what?\" \"A Nook.\" \"Oh, a Nook.\" Repeat this ad nauseam occasionally using other objects around me. Cup. Watch. Plant. What can I say, it's late.

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PsiCop

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@lim: Here you go: \"Just ‘nook’\" — a play in one act. Enjoy.

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Roclawzi

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@PsiCop:
That was utterly fantastic! Did you write that or find it?

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PsiCop

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@Roclawzi: I wrote it.

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catastrophegirl chooses not to fly

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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what possible purpose would it serve to prevent people from spending any form of money on your product?

also, i love this related comic which tackles the subject of the nook in a light that someone in marketing apparently didn't consider

[www.krrobar.com]

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Ebook DRM has long been cracked, you know. Why pay?

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PatrickPortland

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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The FAQ has been updated again:

\"Gift Cards and Gift Certificates currently cannot be used towards an eBook purchase. Please check back for updates.\"

As DigitalMariner mentioned, B&N makes daily updates, but at least the addition of \"check back for updates\" sounds more promising than the matter-of-fact phrasing quoted in the article.

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Parsnip

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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At first glance, an e-book reader seemed like the perfect thing to ask for for Christmas. I glanced around my living room at the masses of books and thought it'd be nice to free up that space. But then I got to thinking about how much I just love my books. I love being able to trade them and lend them and hold them in my hands. I own the books. I don't think an e-book reader is for me.

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PatrickPortland

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@pezstar: I recently built 48 linear feet of bookshelves to house a chunk of our collection (which I have moved 6 times and 12,000+ miles). Yes, the floor and wall space would be otherwise handy, but I wouldn't have it any other way.

Ebooks are cool, sure, but I have some sort of emotional collection to the printed page. Hell, I'm the last person on the planet to still have the newspaper delivered!

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@PatrickPortland: No you're not. :)

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PatrickPortland

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@HogwartsAlum: Ummm, I'm not what? I mean, I know what I'm not most of the time, but in this instance...?

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JulesNoctambule

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@PatrickPortland: 48 linear feet of bookshelves. . .mmmmmm.

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PatrickPortland

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@JulesNoctambule: 200 nuts, 100 washers, 8 six foot 1/2\" threaded rods, a dozen premade stair treads, and an afternoon of drilling and screwing and you too can have shelves one step up from cinder blocks and plywood!

Actually, the look fine, and they're infinitely adjustable, which is kind of neat. Since we're renting, I don't have a lot of incentive to build permanent shelving that I can't take with me when I leave.

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PatrickPortland

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@PatrickPortland: Grrrr... \"connection\" - not \"collection\"

Whatever.

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tbax929

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@pezstar:
I agree. I love, love, love the look of my room that has my bookcases in it. When I finally buy a big house, the library will be the first room I design. I want bookcases going all around the room and ladders that slide around on rails. Can't wait.

I can see the value in a Kindle or other kind of e-reader, but I love books too much to buy one for myself.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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For the life of me, I can't understand why ANYONE would mess with a ebook reader, whether it's a Kindle or a nook... oops... THE nook... oops...

Whatever. Ebooks takes the free flow of ideas (which writers have supposedly considered to be the most precious and inherent right of all mankind) and shackles them with pink furry DRM handcuffs. Ebooks were, are, and will always be the most worthless creation in electronics history, and for me, green is the color my face makes when discussing environmental theory...

2 replies

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dvdchris

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@PencilSharp:
Thank you.
The only advantage I can see to one is having newspapers 'delivered' automatically to it. Then again, you still can't use the newspaper for any additional purpose. You can't give it away when finished with it, leave it on the bus for another person to read, cut out coupons or articles, or use it as packing material.
Same thing with books. You can't give your copy away to a friend? Lame.

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Cogito Ergo Bibo

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@dvdchris: Well, within limits (rather difficult limits) you actually can \"lend\" an ebook. With the nook, you can lend a book to a friend for 14 days (after which time the DRM tells it to go \"poof\"). Eh, better than nothing.

I live in an apartment with no room. Seriously. Storage consists of one closet which is NOT a walk-in. I tend to read popular fiction. I do a lot of research and writing for my day job, so any reading I do off the clock is pure escapism. An ebook reader is perfect for me. I don't have to wait a year for the new popular fiction releases in hardback to become affordable in paperback. They don't take up room. I can keep or delete as I wish with no hassle. And no embarrassing \"you're reading THAT trash?\" when no one can see the cover. That last one is just a bonus. Definitely not for everyone. It just works for me.

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jaymec

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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You can not purchase items overseas with the nook at all. Of course for a long time with the kindle you could only purchase things with a US address/credit card, whether overseas or in the US. People were getting around this by applying a giftcard and removing the credit card from their account if they did not have an American credit card. Maybe this is why the restriction was put into place?

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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B&N execs- Ever hear of an ITunes card? It is a gift card for digital music- My niece weasels one out of my at any checkstand she can. Think about it.

Another place you will lose my money-
So for the last 5 years (at least) B&N managed to pry $25 a year out of our pocket to get a 10% discount. So far it has been worth it, we love books and spend more than the $250 a year needed to make the Membership worth the price.

Since it is cheaper to buy books from Barnes & Noble, we do. Take away that incentive, and we get our books elsewhere. An ebook reader will take away at least 30% of our spending on real books. We will get one soon. No discounts means no need to go to B&N. Make Gift cards unusable for your ereader too and you lose.Don't you want to keep us as loyal customers? Note- I can't wait for my favorite authors- I buy hardcovers- you need me!

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astrid0005

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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I think I see why they won't allow gift cards. The nook isn't available internationally, as was the Kindle until recently. International customers simply have a friend provide the US credit card and have the friend buy you a gift card. You pay your friend and you have the gift card to purchase ebooks. The only logical explanation for banning gift cards is that they caught on to this method by reading Kindle forums.

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FoxintheSnow

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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When you want to purchase ebooks on nook, it's connected to a bn.com account that you set up. Just like in iTunes, you connect a certain credit card to the account, so when you download something, it automatically will charge that account.

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Khayeth

November 18, 2009 4:53 PM

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Well, we have confirmation that the gift card snafu will be remedied as of \"mid December\" from an employee who was updated at the mandatory meeting this past Sunday. Granted, that's a long time to sit on $100 for the original poster. This employee also was completely aware of the no gift card for eBooks and is surprised that the cash wrap employee in the article was not aware.

This person also confirms that their own employee discount does not apply to Nook or accessories either, and that the entire mess is being slowly untangled. Though probably not in a timely enough manner for everybody, and it is a valid concern that new technologies and items hit the market before corporate works out the bugs in all aspects of their system that might apply to the new system.

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