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pecan 3.14159265

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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But Ulta's customer service rep wasn't exactly the fullest lash on the eyelid, if you know what I mean

Does Ulta stock Latisse? That would solve the problem.

It's insane that the CSR didn't have an answer for Daynah. If you don't know, just say so, or say you'll find the answer. But repeating something that doesn't make sense doesn't negate that the other person isn't stupid and definitely knows that you don't have a clue what you're talking about!

8 replies

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bohemian

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@pecan 3.14159265: That repeating loop of nonsense is probably the quickest way to really anger a customer. I wish call center managers would get a clue about this. If someone does not have the answer have them admit it and either escalate the call or direct the person to whatever division or department does. Giving someone a non-answer is just rude and insulting. It says they think the caller is stupid enough to buy something so obviously nonsensical and that they have no respect for the callers time that they are wasting instead of solving the problem.

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nursetim

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@bohemian:
Or the CSR is attempting to use the Jedi mind trick.

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varro

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@bohemian: It's also par for the course with Indian call centers, and one of the hallmarks of Chase after taking over Washington Mutual.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@pecan 3.14159265: I think it's likely that the CSRs there aren't allowed to deviate from prewritten responses, and that they aren't allowed to say \"I don't know\" as a department policy.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@pecan 3.14159265:

...it's the same thing that Apple does though...

Customer \"I'd buy an iPhone if it had cut and paste\"

Apple \"You'll buy the iPhone without cut and paste\"

Customer \"No, really, it needs cut & paste before I buy\"

Apple \"You'll buy the iPhone without cut and paste\"

Customer \"I will buy the iPhone without cut and paste\"

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@YouDidWhatNow?: Except in your example I did buy it, and then they added in cut & paste?

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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In your case, yes. Other people, no. Unless they fell prey to the wily discussion as laid out above only to regret it later.

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pecan 3.14159265

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@YouDidWhatNow?: The fact that the iPhone originally did not have cut and paste was pretty well-known. Anyone who had done any kind of research would have seen this.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@pecan 3.14159265:

Considering the assloads of people with iPhones in hand that bitch and moan about the Ts & Cs that came with it, and related issues like the App Store, it's blatantly obvious that expecting Joe Consumer to do \"any kind of research.\" I see no indication whatsoever that the VAST majority of people on this planet do anything other than what the TV tells them to do.

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hi

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@pecan 3.14159265: But if you jailbroke your iphone it did have cut & paste, and all the things they say it didnt have like.. a camera that can stream & record straight to the internet.

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treimel

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@pecan 3.14159265:

Added bonus nonsense for the no taking photos of the \"storefront\" which--as Google has ably demonstrated, is completely out of their control in any event.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@treimel: Note the picture for this article.

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formergr

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Sounds like the District Manager at least had a clue and was very on the ball in her prompt and appropriate response...

The CSR interaction, on the other hand, would make me beat my head against the desk.

3 replies

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Bob Lu

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@formergr: I'm guessing that their CSRs are not allowed to say anything not pre-scripted or they will be fired or even get their ass sued off.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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And will likely be fired for the comment about her own industry's practices.

Unfair, but true.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@formergr: I know right...I'd have fun with that though. I'd start asking her if she knew what a pen was, at what point did I mention photo taking, etc...hahaha

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idip

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Oh my OP... didn't you realize, when they tell you not to write anything down it's only going to encourage you to tell people how friendly they are!

...

-_-

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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But even given the ridiculous writing objection, what's the problem with photos?

4 replies

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nbs2

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@Ophelia42: That makes a little more sense. It discourages competitor shopping and the co-opting of layouts and displays.

I think.

I'd like some follow up. Can she go back to the store and take notes again?

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KristinaBeana

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@Ophelia42: When I worked in a department store the no photos thing was a security policy. It was in place to supposedly make it more difficult to canvas the store - photos could include where exits are, where security cameras are pointed, layout of merchandise - all things that the professional thieves know ahead of time. Not sure if the policy has an actual impact, but there you go.

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Oranges w/ Cheese hates what Christmas has become

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@KristinaBeana: That plus its a liability, someone gets photographed on their property without signing a photo waiver? I dunno. It could be innumerable different reasons.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@Oranges w/ Cheese has 2 cats! ahahaha.:

I'm not sure it has anything to do with \"public privacy\" - you're in a public place, people can see you.

I think operationally it has to do with making sure competitive shoppers are handicapped as much as possible, but the legalese behind it would be what KristinaBeana said.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@YouDidWhatNow?: In the UK supermarkets constantly watch each other's prices - they're quite open about it and to avoid complications they sign in as visitors and wander round the shop with an ID badge and a clipboard.

To do it any other way would be silly.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Doesn't work that way in the US. I happen to know because I am working with a major retailer (i.e. one of the biggest that exist) at the moment regarding their \"competitive shoppers.\"

They have to do everything on the low-down and not get caught, because they will be thrown out of the competitor's store if they are found out. Sometimes along with a lifetime ban. It's all cloak-and-dagger over here.

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Eyebrows McGee (now with more baby!)

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@KristinaBeana: I can see a legitimacy to that policy, but I have to say, I -- and everyone else I know -- do so much cell-snapping of products these days that I would not go back to somewhere that didn't let me snap photos. When I was shopping for light fixtures I sent my husband a couple snaps of the two I had narrowed it down to so he could offer an opinion. My friend's daughter was allowed just this past weekend to go shopping for winter clothes with her friends without her mother along, and she sent back snaps of a couple of \"borderline\" choices (high-heeled boots, for example) to make sure her mother thought they were appropriate.

I would hope an adequately staffed store could tell the difference between someone snapping a couple different objects, presumably to picture message a friend or (horrors!) comparison shop, and someone casing the joint photographically, which would take a lot more effort and weirder shooting of pictures.

(Also, if I were a thief, I'd get one of those pinhole camera thingies and you'd never know I was recording everything.)

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bohemian

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@Eyebrows McGee (now with more baby!): Stores are going to have to decide if trying to prevent competitors or shoplifters from taking pictures is worth alienating their customers, possibly for life.

I take pictures in stores all the time because I can't remember if the color or style of something works with something I have at home or I want to send Mr. Bohemian a picture of something to get his opinion like furniture or light fixtures.

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squinko

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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It's nice to see that this had a positive ending. A lot of people in the comments on the first article thought she deserved to be kicked out because of what she was doing (a lot of people thought she was price comparing when she wasn't). I can't see how you can be active on a site that champions consumers' rights and then turn around and put down someone who is trying to be an informed consumer, and tries to help others make informed decisions as well.

3 replies

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@squinko: This is the internet. That's how. Haha.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@squinko: I don't think there would be anything wrong with it even if she was price comparing.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@samurailynn: Unless it was competitive spying.

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ptkdude

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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can't take photos of their storefronts? Aren't their storefronts out in public where there is no expectation of privacy?

6 replies

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ptkdude: The way I understand it, you're allowed to take pictures of anything as long as you're standing on public property. Once you're in their store, they can ask you to not take pictures while you're on their private property and have you arrested for tresspassing if you don't comply.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@secret_curse: so me & my ultra ultra zoom lens on the street should be ok then :)

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lucky929

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ptkdude: I'm not sure. Mall cops reprimanded a friend and I for taking pictures of storefronts that we were using for Christmas cards. So it's not unheard of.

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Kimaroo - 100% Pure Natural Kitteh

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@lucky929: That is interesting.. it may be different inside a mall though. Most of the Ulta stores I've ever seen are in strip malls (IE. The storefront is outside.)

This makes me think harder about when I do my \"A day in the life\" photo journals.. I usually take a picture of the outside of wherever I go.

I can't see not doing it though.. it's fun.

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MoreFunThanToast

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@ptkdude: Depending on where the store is located, many malls are actually commercially owned private properties. The entire city of Irvine, CA is pretty much privately owned and all their malls and what not have security guards shouting NO PHOTOS and want to take our cameras.

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catastrophegirl chooses not to fly

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@MoreFunThanToast: that makes me want to go there and take pictures and press charges for armed robbery for taking my camera away. i bet that would get the no photo thug policy to be looked at a little more closely

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$\"user-pic\"$

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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It makes me want to go the local store and photograph the store front. Public view in a public place.

1 replies

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idip

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@jackjackson: Just make sure you're on the street and not sidewalk. O.o

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ellemm

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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It makes me want to go to the local store, photograph the store front, print the photo then return to the store to write notes about their products. On the photo. Then maybe I'll scan my note covered photo and do some comparison shopping. I'll probably come to the conclusion that I don't shop at Ulta because I can buy everything they offer from other businesses with fewer stupid rules.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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That exchange sounds like a bad imitation of a Monty Python sketch.

2 replies

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@scouts honor: Beautiful plumage, those Ulta stores.

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JulesNoctambule

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@howie_in_az: A palindrome of Ulta would be Atla.

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JulesNoctambule

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@JulesNoctambule: Damn it! 'Atlu' - stupid, joke-ruining sticking keyboard.

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RecordStoreToughGuy_starcommandseries.com

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@JulesNoctambule: I think you mean \"Notlob.\"

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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New store policy: It is against store policy to do anything, which allows you to compare our prices with any other outlet, including, but not limited to: photographing, writing, texting, use of a mobile internet device, talking into a voice recorder or any other device capable of transcription or memorizing prices. If we catch you trying to record store prices, we reserve the right to immediately charge you for the purchase and to confiscate the device with which you attempting to record said price. If you are memorizing the price, then you will have to listen to Eminem for 20 hours straight or until we believe you've long forgotten the price.

2 replies

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Aisley

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@vastrightwing:

Oh dear! You forgot a little vital \"something\" in that new policy: \"If you continue daring to breath while inside our store, we reserve for ourselves the right to kick you out of the store while looking great with the new Revlon Minerals cosmetic line.\"

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your new nemesis

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@vastrightwing: don't forget that when attempting to comparison shop via the internet a cookie will be installed to prevent accessing competitors websites.

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jamesdenver

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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I took a photo of a Safeway gas station (from the sidewalk) and was practically labeled a terrorist.

[www.futuregringo.com]

3 replies

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idip

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@jamesdenver: Bummer :-(

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@jamesdenver: Ha, interesting post. I would hot have thought that could happen.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@HogwartsAlum: *Not, not hot. Sorry I can't type today :P

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Applekid

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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I'm saddened that Ulta is no longer doing their part for stamping out literacy.

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Quake 'n' Shake

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Holy crap, this failure to understand on the part of the Ulta CSR reminds me of a conversation I had with Honda once:
Me: I didn't want to spend more than \"X\" amount of money or have the loan length exceed 3 years
Honda CSR: You know most people would rather have a lower monthly payment, even if that means borrowing more for a longer period of time.
Me: Regardless, that's not what I wanted to do. The salesman refused to acknowledge what I wanted.
Honda CSR: You know most people would rather have a lower monthly payment, even if that means borrowing more for a longer period of time.
Me: ARRRRRGGHHH!!!! I see the problem now. It's a corporate-wide thing. You're all dense!

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Interesting. I was at the Famous Farmer's Market in LA this summer on Vacation. They have a Hot Sauce store in there, pretty cool- about a billion different Hot Sauces and Spicy food items. I had three bottles worth $20.00 in my hand (about to buy)... when my son and I ran across some coffee. The brand of this coffee was \"Wake The F**k Up!!\" Coffee. We thought it was hilarious.

I'm not a coffee drinker, but my sister is, So I handed the 3 bottles to my son, and I took a picture of the coffee for her. At that instant, the person working there (owner/proprietor?) yelled at me from across the (very small) store. She rudely yelled, \"No takee pictures! Put cam-rah 'way!!\"

I turned to my son, and said, \"Put those bottles down, let's get out of here.\"

Great policy. I have the picture PLUS my twenty bucks. I wonder if she's still in business.

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redskull

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Next will be the \"no looking at prices and trying to memorize them\" policy.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Yay for the followup!

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H3ion

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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If you have eidetic memory and walk into an Ulta store, do they try to confiscate your mind?

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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I never did start a flash mob of ulta, although some of the other consumerist cohorts might have done it. Although I do kind of want to run amuk with a camera in cosmetics areas now.

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Saboth

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Obviously, the CSR knew she was a great sketch artist and was going to draw pictures of the makeup, and therefore expose their huge secret to competitors.

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Straspey

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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Here in New York City, we have a small clothing retailer called
\"SYMM'S\" with about three or four outlets in the local area.

For years they have ended every commercial by proudly intoning their motto:

\"Here at Symm's, and informed consumer is our best customer.\"

It's a wonderful place to find great deals on quality clothing and prides itself on having a knowledgeable staff who's objective is that every customer leave happy.

\"An informed consumer is our best customer.\"

Unfortunately, for many of the mall-centric retailers, they seem to prefer stupid customers who keep their mouths shut, make their purchases and get out.

BTW...As you leave SYMM'S, the person at the front door does not ask to see your receipt. They smile and say, \"Thanks for shopping at SYMM'S today.\"

1 replies

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November 18, 2009 4:53 PM

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@Straspey: Coincidentally, Sy Syms died yesterday. This story probably killed him!

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laffmakr

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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I still don't understand why Daynah actually knuckled under the asshole clerk.

No one should need anything so badly they have to accept that type of abusive treatment.

And actually, Daynah should have take a few hundred dollars worth of product to the register and used a charge card.

When asked to sign, simply say \"I'm sorry, I'm not allowed to write anything down in this store.\" Take the receipt and walk with it.

1 replies

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Rectilinear Propagation

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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@laffmakr: Testing these products for consumers is her job.

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November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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An apology and a gift certificate doesn't mean that the store manager has learned anything or that behaviors will be changed. A few years ago, I had found a great stylist at an Ulta close to my workplace. What I found was that setting up appointments was irrelevant - I was routinely squeezed out by walk-in customers, and sometimes had to leave without getting my hair cut because I could not wait for the walk-in customer to be finished. When I complained to Ulta's HQ I got... an apology and a gift certificate. Used the GC on my very last visit, which was supposed to include a hair cut... but I was squeezed out again.

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sevenwhitehorses

November 18, 2009 4:52 PM

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lets all go in with hidden cams and post vids of their store AND storefront on youtube, just for the fun of it. it must have been beyond frustrating for you to hear her go over and over about a photo and never even address your comments. i am glad they came to their senses (at least a little) and have fun with your gift certificate!!

1 replies

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November 18, 2009 4:53 PM

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@sevenwhitehorses: I'm seriously planning on going to my (new!) local Ulta this week to do some comparison shopping...with a notebook and pen. I'll post if I run into any trouble.

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November 18, 2009 4:53 PM

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\"But Ulta's customer service rep wasn't exactly the fullest lash on the eyelid, if you know what I mean.\"

LOL

Don't you love the people some of these companies put on their phones, not once thinking the fool could be the only contact a customer has with corporate?

I normally run into these \"loops\" when I call a company and reach a call center in India. Nothing again the people of India, but my experience is the reps are taught to read from about 50 cue cards depending on the question and if you ask question 51, they go read whatever one pops up, even if it has nothing to do with your question.

They then, proudly, ask if there is anything else they can do for you today, as if they have been a great help by not answering your question! (eye roll)

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