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htowninsomniac
November 24, 2009 11:33 AM
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Fully cooked means safe to eat. It doesn't mean hot.

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8one6
November 24, 2009 12:23 PM
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Exactly! Hot dogs are fully cooked, but most people don't expect them to be meal ready out of the package.

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Bohemian
November 24, 2009 12:12 PM
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It depends on the context. A \"fully cooked\" ham out of the meat department fridge case the expectation would be that it is cold. The \"fully cooked\" just means it is not in a raw state thus not requiring a long cooking time. The same with hot dogs, they claim to be fully cooked, ie: you won't get sick from eating them raw. Getting sick from other issues with hot dogs is another story.

If your getting a turkey from the deli you expect it to be cooked and hot. We have bought either the turkey or the whole meal that comes with sides around Thanksgiving a couple of different years from Hyvee without a problem or needing to cook the turkey yourself when you get home.

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Noir
November 24, 2009 11:58 AM
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yes, BUT I think she was clear about her needs, and having talked to three different people would give you some sense of safety about things not going wrong. Even more if you explain that you need it for a lunch at work, they could've easily made the turkey hours before the picked it up so it would still be fresh, right?

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Cant_stop_the_rock
November 24, 2009 12:18 PM
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She thought she was clear about what she wanted, and the employees probably thought they understood what she wanted. Unfortunately there was a disconnect.

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Cant_stop_the_rock
November 24, 2009 11:35 AM
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Well, I buy fully cooked frozen chicken all the time. Fully cooked doesn't necessarily mean hot. But I don't think I would have assumed a fully cooked turkey would be cold, and in absence of a product that the customer could look at and see that it's cold, I think it's important to mention that it's not a hot turkey.

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pecan 3.14159265
November 24, 2009 12:59 PM
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I agree that fully cooked turkey doesn't have to mean hot - but it's not an illogical thought, and all Publix had to do was print off a sign. Really, it takes less than five minutes. They could have avoided a lot of trouble if they had just told their customers that fully cooked doesn't mean it's hot.

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burnedout
November 24, 2009 2:42 PM
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Aaack, you have a new avatar - it will be hard to get used to who is who without the usual pics :)

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pecan 3.14159265
November 24, 2009 3:05 PM
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Yep, but I'm switching back to the Pecan avatar because I found myself looking for familiar avatars and being puzzled as to why some people have different ones. So I see what you mean!

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burnedout
November 24, 2009 12:54 PM
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I agree, but when you order at a DELI counter the general expectation is that it's ready to eat.

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Vanilla5
November 24, 2009 11:35 AM
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I'm a pretty smart cookie myself and I think I would've thought that the turkey would be fully-cooked and hot since every Publix deli I've been to has rotisserie and cooking capabilities (and you can order hot food right there). I think that's a very important detail to make sure that people understand when they order a \"fully cooked\" turkey.

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The Marionette
November 24, 2009 1:32 PM
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There's plenty of things that are fully cooked but aren't hot. I would say lunch meats, but someone would have to be pretty dumb to expect it to be hot. I've bought turkeys fully cooked and already knew they weren't hot. And besides, the op should've asked are they hot.

As far as the op's \"ONE: it is almost fully cooked, aka the directions on it say to heat in the oven at 350 degrees for 90-120 minutes\" That's called heating it up. You wouldn't exactly stick the thing in a microwave to heat it up. So it's not \"almost\" fully cooked, it is fully cooked. If you cook some dinner one day and decide to store and freeze it, it's still fully cooked, just not hot.

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saturnleia
November 26, 2009 1:45 AM
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Cooking a turkey at 350 degrees for 90-120 minutes would cook it pretty well, not just warm it up. As a reference point: I cooked a 15-pound turkey on Sunday at 375 degrees for 150 minutes, and it went from raw to an internal temp of 165 degrees in that time. Most recipes advise cooking at 325 degrees for around 3-4 hours depending on the turkey's size.

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treimel
November 24, 2009 12:06 PM
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Well, the one's I've seen have rotisseries that can accomodate (smallish) chickens. Do you realize the size rotisserie you'd need to cook a big ol' turkey? Let's put it this way: There's a reason the phrase is \"rotisserie chicken\" is a lot more common than \"rotisserie turkey.\"

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catastrophegirl chooses not to fly
November 24, 2009 3:15 PM
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thanks, that gives me an idea for next year... now to learn how to weld.....

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idip
November 24, 2009 11:36 AM
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Wow... I do feel bad for the manager. :-( and the OP.

The employees def. should have told her what she was getting. But I can also see that some (not all) people who have retail jobs can not really care.

I stopped going to my local Quiznos because the people there are not too.... bright.

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teletone
November 24, 2009 11:36 AM
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Yes, I supposed to prevent confusion, but \"Fully Cooked\" makes no claims about freshness (fresh as in \"just made\"). Hell, the coldcut slices you buy say the same thing.

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plutonyum
November 24, 2009 11:38 AM
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Fully cooked doesn't mean hot. Hot dogs are fully cooked too, yet somehow when I pick them up in the refrigerated case they are cold to the touch. The 90-120 minutes for \"cooking\" seems to be the time it would take to make a cooked but subsequently refrigerated turkey into a hot meal. Those things are big.

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KilgoreTrout
November 24, 2009 12:04 PM
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I agree that fully cooked != hot, but considering the op talked to several people in the deli and told them she needed a turkey for lunch at work, someone should've made sure she realized she was getting a bird that needed some oven time.

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Taliskan
November 24, 2009 12:12 PM
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Another hour or two to reheat a whole turkey is going to result in a very dry turkey. I am guessing the deli was thinking she would get the turkey, she would carve it up at the office, and nuke it. The sticker/label of how to warm up the meal is probably the same sticker they slap on everything that's in the refrigerated cooked meal section of the store. I typically hate to blame the OP, but a little thinking outside the box and knowing that the devil is in the details would've made the day better.

It still boggles my mind of reheating a whole turkey at cooking temps for a couple of hours. Just... no. No one should do that.

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IfThenElvis
November 24, 2009 11:38 AM
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Fully Cooked does not mean hot. Butterball sells Frozen Fully Cooked Turkeys. Thaw, heat, and serve.

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inadequatewife
November 24, 2009 9:59 PM
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All of the grocery stores around here offer the \"fully cooked\" turkey with or without the trimmings. It's not a Butterball, but it comes in a cryovac bag inside a decorative box. The side dishes are in aluminum trays with cardboard lids. Everything comes in pre-cooked, and frozen. The store needs sufficient \"notice\" so they can defrost it before handing it to the customer. The brochures and posters are all quite clear that you can have your meal ready in 60 minutes - the time required to heat the turkey in the oven.

That being said, Publix does have the responsibility of making sure customers know what they are receiving. It can be misleading when they serve freshly roasted chickens with hot sides, but the turkey dinner is cold.

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CyGuy
November 24, 2009 3:46 PM
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In fact, there is no reason to believe that isn't what the OP actually got, minus the packaging, with the thawing already done. If I ran a deli, it's what I would do.

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mianne
November 24, 2009 11:42 AM
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The circular I recently saw for Publix clearly mentioned the turkeys are \"Heat and Serve\" or such. Don't know how the OP came to learn that Publix sold pre-cooked turkeys. But I had no doubt that an oven would be needed first, though I would have expected that I could have made turkey sandwiches without any heating first.

I'm trying to picture the logistical challenge of timing various customer orders based on turkey size, expected pickup time and oven capacity to be able to offer everyone a hot turkey even with advance orders, or at least how to form a large enough array of heat lamps to keep a few dozen 14 lb. turkeys hot.

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baquwards
November 25, 2009 12:58 AM
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exactly, grocery stores are not equipped to keep turkey dinners hot and waiting for people. People rarely show up on time to pick up orders, it's OK with cakes and bread and such, but keeping stuff at a safe eating temp, is tricky.

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Kogenta
November 24, 2009 11:42 AM
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I'm sort of mixed on this one. I can completely see the reasoning behind storing the FULLY COOKED Turkey cold if they have no idea when the customer is coming to get it. Can you imagine how terrible the turkey in question would be if they sat it under heat lamps or whatnot all day?

If the customer said they were coming in at X time to get the turkey, then I can see how it might make sense for the store to heat it up beforehand. But I think they should mention it, because even if it's the norm at the store, some people have no idea what the norm is.

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katinka
November 24, 2009 11:43 AM
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My mom mentioned something like this earlier this week; last year my uncle picked up a turkey from the grocery store and while it was fully cooked, it was also frozen on the inside.

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kaceetheconsumer
November 24, 2009 11:46 AM
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Fully cooked doesn't necessarily mean hot, since a lot of processed foods are fully cooked, but given that the turkey meal is more like one of those rotisserie chicken deals, it is reasonable to assume that at least some customers will expect that it is hot. Therefore, the store should have all staff be clear that while it is cooked, it won't be hot for pickup.

Also, if it says that it should be heated for a long time in an oven, that could be confusing...is it really fully cooked or, as the OP says, almost fully cooked? If it's like the Costco chickens we get, it's theoretically fully cooked and doesn't require reheating but we have had Costco chickens that actually weren't 100% cooked at the thigh joints (big pain in the butt when we were in a hotel with nothing but a microwave). So we take that label to mean \"almost cooked\" and always cook ours more.

I don't think the OP should have had to ask if it was hot or not because there's a reasonable expectation that a turkey meal comes ready to serve, since most places do it that way. The store should have made it clear.

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CyGuy
November 24, 2009 3:57 PM
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If you bought CostCo rotisserie chickens that weren't fully cooked you should have gone back to the store and demanded your money back - half the reson for belonging to CostCo is there money-back guarantee. Those are sold as ready to eat, and if they sold you one that was not ready to eat, they were endangering your health and risking a lawsuit. But if you accept it as a given that they will sometimes be undercooked and don't report it so the store doesn't realize they are serving unsafe products, you are contributing to the problem.

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humphrmi
November 24, 2009 11:47 AM
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Did she tell them that it was essentially a catering event? I deal with food service ordering for events all the time, even if you're not asking them to cater the event for you, if you mention that it's a catered event that usually tips them off that you expect ready-to-serve food. On the other hand, it sounds like the employees were not very detail-oriented anyway, probably due to trying to keep up with an onslaught of orders.

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wblewett
November 24, 2009 11:47 AM
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When I hear \"cooked, sliced turkey\" I think of lunch meat. Cold, delicious lunch meat. After reading her recount of the story I still don't know for sure what she wanted. Did she?

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Jevia
November 24, 2009 11:47 AM
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I agree that fully cooked does not necessarily equal hot, but when the OP said that three people knew she was getting food for a work lunch, they should have mentioned that the turkey was not hot and the instructions require 90-120 minutes oven cooking. Most offices have microwaves that can heat up the side dishes, but not a turkey.

I don't understand the \"de-boning\" fee. She didn't ask for a 'de-boned' turkey, just a hot one.

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Kuchen
November 24, 2009 11:51 AM
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I agree with other commenters that \"fully-cooked\" doesn't actually MEAN hot. However, the employees should have known and informed the OP of what it meant when she told them what the turkey was for, especially since this seems to have been a known issue. I also looked into getting a pre-cooked turkey this year, and at least the Boston Market website makes it quite clear that there are two options: catered food that arrives hot, and food that is cooked but you have to heat up yourself.

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treimel
November 24, 2009 11:52 AM
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I'm afraid I have to join the chorus--\"fully cooked\" simply does not mean hot. Stroll around the supermarket and read some labels; they're are hundreds of products that are labelled fully cooked, but aren't hot. The pfrase means safe to eat, not hot. It's just not Publix's fault that the OP doesn't understand a common phrase. And , no repeating the phrase in all caps doesn't change anything aboput this story--it *is* fully cooked; it takes an hour and a half simply to heat a giant bird, that's not evidence of it being un-cooked, it's physics.

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treimel
November 24, 2009 11:52 AM
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I'm afraid I have to join the chorus--\"fully cooked\" simply does not mean hot. Stroll around the supermarket and read some labels; they're are hundreds of products that are labelled fully cooked, but aren't hot. The pfrase means safe to eat, not hot. It's just not Publix's fault that the OP doesn't understand a common phrase. And , no repeating the phrase in all caps doesn't change anything aboput this story--it *is* fully cooked; it takes an hour and a half simply to heat a giant bird, that's not evidence of it being un-cooked, it's physics.

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Changed my name to \"I like potatoes\"
November 24, 2009 2:09 PM
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The spiral sliced hams that they sell in the supermarket come to mind. Fully cooked, yet they have a long reheating time.

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morganlh85
November 24, 2009 11:52 AM
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While I understand that the turkey COULD be cold and meant to be reheated, the staff, after listening to her explain what she was ordering for, should have made it clear, and after her conversation with the manager it's clear that the staff are too lazy and/or stupid to provide adequate customer service.

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mobilene
November 24, 2009 11:52 AM
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If I'm looking to buy a hot turkey for an office Thanksgiving meal, I'm going in with a preconceived notion in my head. So when I see \"fully cooked,\" my brain assumes it means \"hot,\" because that's what I'm looking for. Publix needs to understand that people may be looking for a hot turkey and end up being fooled by the \"fully cooked\" line, and modify the line accordingly, perhaps to \"fully cooked but delivered cold.\"

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pecan 3.14159265
November 24, 2009 1:02 PM
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I think it's also that most people associate the deli counter with deli meats and the rotisserie chicken area, so when you get a fully cooked chicken, more often than not, it's a rotisserie chicken that is hot. It would make sense if there was a misconception that because you're ordering a la carte at the deli counter, that the turkey would be a fully cooked hot turkey because the deli counter also sells fully cooked hot chickens.

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FatLynn
November 24, 2009 11:53 AM
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It's not fully-cooked if the instructions then say to cook it. They should call it \"fast-cooking\" or something else to indicate you need two hours in the oven, not eight to ten.

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treimel
November 24, 2009 12:00 PM
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But you're not cooking it, you're re-heating it. Yes, the re-heating takes a while but that has to do with the size of the object. The distinction matters because it is *safe to eat* (i.e., cooked) right from the store. I, for one, eat cold cooked turkey this time of year, but I digress. They certainly should not talk about \"cooking\" it, because, once again, it is already fully-cooked.

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wblewett
November 24, 2009 11:54 AM
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Ten to one the instructions say \"heat\" not \"cook\"

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SpiderPaintingDollars
November 24, 2009 11:54 AM
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What a hot mess... well I guess it shows you that there are a lot of turkeys in the trade.... anyone?

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lukesdad
November 24, 2009 11:59 AM
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She should just quit shopping at that store cold turkey. Am I right?

Ba dum bum.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 24, 2009 11:56 AM
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I voted 'Yes' since the Deli Manager themselves said that they've been meeting daily to emphasize that they need to to tell people it won't be hot. That means that lots of people are making that assumption, enough that they've made it a rule that they have to tell people.

If the manager is telling them to let people know it'll be a cold bird then yes, they should be doing that.

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Cogito Ergo Bibo
November 24, 2009 11:58 AM
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There are a ton of things that are sold fully-cooked yet cold. See any canned stew or meat, hot dogs, time-saver chicken, etc. In fact, to me, fully-cooked means cold. It's a way to say, \"Yep. It's cold. But all you have to do is reheat it since it's been safely cooked and refrigerated/frozen.\" Unless someone says \"hot,\" I don't expect it in a grocery. And where in the heck are they supposed to store a ton of preordered, hot turkeys?

I can still give the OP the benefit of the doubt if she hasn't ordered something like this before. The deli counter can be confusing when you generally have rotisserie birds lying around. I'm more inclined to say that the OP should have asked, but since the burden on the store to say \"it's cold\" is low, it might be a good thing to start doing. But she got a cooked bird, as advertised. Publix was very kind to try and make up for the OP's confusion. Not required (in my mind), but good business.

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GearheadGeek
November 24, 2009 12:01 PM
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While \"fully cooked\" just means that it's been completely cooked and is edible but not necessarily hot, the problem I have with Publix' prior description of this bird as fully cooked is that it apparently is NOT FULLY COOKED. If it needs 90-120 min at 350 to be ready to eat (not just at serving temperature) it's par-cooked and is probably not safe to eat. As we'll all be reminded in a few days, you can safely eat fully-cooked turkey cold or pop a serving into the microwave to bring it up to temperature. Par-cooked != fully cooked and shouldn't be advertised as such.

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baquwards
November 25, 2009 1:05 AM
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I work in a grocery store that sells these meals. They are FULLY COOKED! They do take over an hour to heat all the way through, I have heated them for in store employee holiday dinners. The reason that they say to heat that long is so that they are at a safe serving temp of 165 degrees just as any other heat and eat item, the manufacturer wants to cover their butt.

I have heated them according to directions and they were not \"leather\", they were not the best turkey on the planet, but very much edible.

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treimel
November 25, 2009 1:51 PM
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You've misunderstood the 165 degrees thing--reaching that temp matters *the first time its cooked* There's nothing dangerous about consuming cooked turkey that's then (say) zero degrees.

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treimel
November 24, 2009 12:11 PM
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Bull--a big cooked turkey *will* need to be heated for an hour and a half to get hot slices out of the middle of it--turkeys have a lot of volume compared to the their surface area. I can guarantee you Publix is not selling par cooked as fully cooked--a large grocery chain is simnly not gouing to court that kind of liability.

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GearheadGeek
November 24, 2009 12:28 PM
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I think that fully-cooked turkey breast won't survive 2 hours at 350F without turning to leather. The dark meat would probably still be edible, but once we get the turkey cooked we reheat portions rather than the whole bird to avoid drying out the white meat, and it still sometimes needs gravy. I'm more into the dark meat in the first place, though, so I'm extra picky about dry breast meat.

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mmmsoap
November 25, 2009 10:10 AM
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Starting from cold, then surviving 350F for 90-120 minutes is a very different scenario that keeping a bird that's already up-to-temperature in the oven for an extra 90-120 minutes. Similar to how heating ice-water will melt the ice first, then raised the temperature of the water after the ice is all melted, the bird will not experience the same effects of high temperature if it's starting cold. (Some of them, maybe, but you most likely won't get shoe-leather.)

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wblewett
November 24, 2009 12:11 PM
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Show me the words \"par cooked\" in the story. I count the words fully cooked (in capitals as if to ascribe some additional meaning) several times. The 60-90 minutes is for heating. You're doing the same thing the lady in the story did - assuming that words indicate something other than their plain-meaning.

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GearheadGeek
November 24, 2009 12:24 PM
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It was 90-120 minutes, and if you bake fully-cooked turkey breast for another 120 minutes at 350F, you'll get leather out of the oven. (Yes, I realize we're talking about the whole bird and not just the breast, but the fattier portions like the legs and thighs will survive overcooking and still be pleasant to eat. If it's really fully cooked and then baked another 2 hours, the breast will be suitable for making shoes, not dinner.)

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eelmonger
November 24, 2009 12:29 PM
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Please Google \"reheat precooked turkey\". Every result is in line with the 90-120min cooking time.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 24, 2009 12:01 PM
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I'll also say that I'm surprised to see a complaint against Publix on Consumerist. I've only ever heard good things about Publix.

Good on that manager for not only making sure the OP had something hot but calling up the previous orders to make sure they knew what they were getting.

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Smashville
November 24, 2009 12:04 PM
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What happens if you thaw the turkey without heating it? Would it be safe to eat?

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KilgoreTrout
November 24, 2009 12:11 PM
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It should've been safe to cut up for sandwiches or something. I don't know about you, but i love cold, thick-cut turkey breast on a sammich the day after Thanksgiving...

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Smashville
November 24, 2009 12:36 PM
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I agree. I love the cold turkey with cranberry sauce on a sandwich. I'm just wondering if this particular bird required additional prep or if the heating was a preference thing.

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HRGirl wants a cookie
November 24, 2009 12:07 PM
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I put up with this last week and it was awful. The problem is that at many grocery stores the catering calls are routed through the deli. So even though the customer has the expectations of normal catering (hot food, racks & sternos included, delivery upon request), the deli will treat it like any other order. Twice last week I got all the way through the ordering process before the person said \"oh, and you have someplace to reheat this, right?\". Finally I learned to ask first if it came hot, if it came pre-carved, if gravy was included in the cost, etc. Overall the experience was way more complicated than it needed to be.

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PølάrβǽЯ
November 24, 2009 12:07 PM
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No, fully cooked does NOT mean hot. You can buy fully coked meats in the refrigerated and frozen foods sections of the supermarket.

However, fully cooked in a DELI certainly implies hot. When I purchase cooked food in a deli, I expect it to be ready to serve and eat. A whole cooked turkey is meant to be served and eaten hot, thus I would expect it to be hot.

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ubermex
November 24, 2009 12:12 PM
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So do you not buy sliced meats in the deli?

The deli sells a TON of fully cooked, but cold things.

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pecan 3.14159265
November 24, 2009 1:26 PM
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I think the confusion lies in the rotisserie chicken area being nearly always in the deli area. Since the deli area prepares ready to eat food that may be eaten cold, or should be heated up first (whether for taste or for safety), it isn't reasonable to think that perhaps the deli counter was taking turkey orders a la carte and providing fully cooked hot turkeys - they provide fully cooked hot chickens, after all.

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flyingember
November 24, 2009 12:07 PM
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That's just a confusing story. I sold these kind of meals off and on for 9 years at Hy-Vee. One year I personally took orders for > 100 holiday meals and put together 250-300 of them. We took dozens of holiday catering orders per week as well. we could sell sliced lunch meat trays, cold turkey breast sliced, picked turkeys, whole turkeys hot or cold, etc.

There were two mistakes made here.
1. she did not specifically clarify she needed everything hot. The employee at Publix not asking should have raised a red flag if she was that experienced
2. the store did not ask if she needed everything hot or cold

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calquist
November 24, 2009 8:01 PM
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I love Hy-Vee to death and I ordered Thanksgiving catered from them last year. I thought I was getting homemade items like they sell at the counter that I ordered the meal from, but what I got was prepackaged prepared items. Maybe I was way off in assuming that I was picking up a hot meal (which is why I never complained to the store), but it looked like they just went around and pulled everything off the shelves (nothing was heated or cooked or prepared in anyway by someone at Hyvee beforehand and they all came in packaging with nutrition facts and plastic wrap.. even the rolls).

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admiral_stabbin
November 24, 2009 6:12 PM
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Small world. I may have visited by the Hy-Vee you worked at, and the Publix the OP is referring to. I don't recall Publix having a full-service deli like Hy-Vee has, but they definitely could have changed since I last went to one.

The store has obviously had this problem before, and should do their best to align expectations. That being said, there are a lot of stupid people in this world. You can try and tell them the simplest of concepts...many times over...and these either aren't listening, or it goes right over their head. This situation sounds like there may have been a bit of \"noise\" on both ends of the line.

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SunnyLea
November 24, 2009 12:08 PM
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I'm glad the manager worked with you and it is always good in the customer service industry to identify and correct common misunderstandings.

However, fully-cooked does not, and hasn't ever, meant hot.

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ubermex
November 24, 2009 12:08 PM
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I have too much Publix loyalty to be unbiased. Abstain.

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SunnyLea
November 24, 2009 12:15 PM
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Yeah, that too.

I won't shop anywhere else. If my husband wants it cheaper, he's the one that has to go to the Wal*mart or the Kroger. I refuse.

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Keep talking...I'm listening
November 24, 2009 12:12 PM
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I can see where the confusion came in...almost all items purchased at a deli counter are ready to eat. I'm not sure what made the deli turkeys different from the ones at the meat counter. I feel bad for the OP and the manager -- it turned out to be embarrassing for both parties.

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TCama
November 24, 2009 12:12 PM
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Fully cooked doesn't NECESSARILY mean hot, but the grocery store definitely should have made that abundantly clear.

I guess the OP should take it as a learning experience.

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MercuryPDX
November 24, 2009 12:17 PM
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The fully cooked 5lb. Honeybaked Ham I bought at the mall yesterday came out of their fridge. I didn't expect it to be hot when I got it.

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Bohemian
November 24, 2009 12:21 PM
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From my experience with at least the Hyvee deli departments they have two kinds of employees. Ones that know what is going on and rock at their jobs. The other being clueless boobs that seem to just get in the way of everyone else working there.

I watched a deli worker try to pack some pasta salad into a container and the task seemed to have the complexity of disarming a bomb. It also took nearly ten minutes and we were the only people at the counter. The workers that have a grasp of their job will have it done before they are done asking you if you need anything else.

Why this week could be a nightmare for a deli manager is quite understandable.

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deesee
November 24, 2009 12:25 PM
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Look, many items come \"fully-cooked\" but are sold cold. Deli meats, hot dogs, and even fully-cooked bacon are available, but they're refrigerated until purchased for health reasons. Otherwise, the store would have to hold all the potential sales at 145 degrees, which would waste a lot of energy and space.

If this OP is truly as experienced in event planning as she claims, one would hope he/she realizes that most fully-cooked items are not sold hot. Publix didn't make the OP look stupid in front of the new boss, the OP did.

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chiieddy
November 24, 2009 12:25 PM
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I've never had a store bought dinner/turkey that didn't require it be reheated. It's standard practice.

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muddgirl
November 24, 2009 12:27 PM
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When you buy \"fully-cooked\" sausage from the freezer section, do you expect it to be hot?

Look, it's horrible customer service not to make sure that you're giving the customer exactly what she wants, but Publix and similar-style stores are pretty clear that they are NOT caterers. If she wanted a catered luncheon then she should have made that clear, as the manager stated.

Maybe I over-rely on the internet? Because 2 seconds of googling confirms: \"The centerpiece of the traditional holiday feast is a succulent, Publix Deli Fully Cooked Turkey. Ours simply requires heating before serving\"

Also, I'm not much more perceptive than Wendy because I misread the poll and voted No when I really think Yes!

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xdreamwalker
November 24, 2009 12:31 PM
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I worked in a supermarket deli for a few years and we were told to remind everyone that called to order that these were fully cooked, but cold meals. Yes the ones we had were fully cooked, you could eat them with no further cooking, but they were cold.

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Shaftoe
November 24, 2009 12:44 PM
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In as much as i voted yes, Fully cooked merely statest that the food you bought has been cooked. EG a Ham or in this case a turkey. In fact in the deli case when you get sliced meats those are \"Fully Cooked\" but you do not expect the cold cuts to be hot.

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Meetch
November 24, 2009 12:46 PM
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When I buy \"fully cooked\" sausage, I still intend to grill or brown it. It just means that, if I wanted to eat it cold, it won't kill me.

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Ronin Democrat
November 24, 2009 12:50 PM
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Enter text...Seems like the manager is not communicating to his underlings.

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Keep talking...I'm listening
November 24, 2009 12:58 PM
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There's got to be a joke about quitting cold turkey somewhere in this...just can't quite formulate it...

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Hoss
November 24, 2009 1:23 PM
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I hope her new boss doesn't read this. It's called \"live and learn\" -- not blame others. This would have been a charming story to recant in front of new co-workers. It tells them you're human and you can laugh at yourself. Not every project comes with perfect instructions on every step of the process. We need to figure things out and anticipate problems.

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Xay
November 24, 2009 1:31 PM
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I would have double checked to make sure that it was going to be fully cooked AND hot. The Publix delis in my city all serve hot and cold fully cooked food.

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Outrun1986
November 24, 2009 1:36 PM
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There are a lot of stores here (Wegmans and Tops) that advertise that you can buy a fully cooked and ready turkey dinner to be enjoyed on thanksgiving so I can totally see where the confusion is. These meals are advertised as in you pick them up and eat them right after they are picked up without any additional prep. If it was that big of a deal you would think they would have signs posted that the turkey has to be heated before eating even though that probably wouldn't help much.

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pdxazn
November 24, 2009 1:40 PM
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When I purchase something at a Deli, I expect it to be ready to eat, not frozen.

If I purchase it at the meat department, it is okay to be frozen. It doesn't matter if it is labeled fully cooked or not.

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Xzigraz
November 24, 2009 1:46 PM
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Happened to me last year at Safeway. I ordered a turkey about a week before Thanksgiving and they said I need to pick it up on Thanks Giving eve so that's what I did and I got a cold cooked bird. If it is cold, why do I have to wait until that eve to pick it up? Can't i pick it up right away?

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passiveactivist
November 24, 2009 2:00 PM
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I used to work at publix in the bakery. . . They are usually so on top of their customer service, and go so above and so beyond that it borders on ridiculous. People would take back milk from Winn-dixie that had expired a week ago and Publix would let them exchange it for new, good Publix milk.....A very liberal exchange policy to say the least.

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jimstoic
November 24, 2009 2:04 PM
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1. Fully cooked doesn't mean hot.
2. But it behooves deli people to say so when talking with a customer on the phone.

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csmcdonald
November 24, 2009 2:32 PM
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From the Publix website - they clearly disclose that the turkey requires heating.

The centerpiece of the traditional holiday feast is a succulent, Publix Deli Fully Cooked Turkey. Ours simply requires heating before serving and comes with four delicious sides; 2.75 lb Old-Fashioned Cornbread Dressing, 2.75 lb Homestyle Mashed Potatoes, 32 oz Gravy and 8 oz Cranberry-Orange Relish. Each side has 4—6 servings. If you would like to add more sides to your meal, view a complete list of available Publix Deli side dishes.

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MameDennis
November 24, 2009 2:32 PM
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Since Chez Mame's on the move next month and most of my kitchenware is in boxes, I actually considered getting a precooked turkey this year. That the turkey is meant to be reheated later seems... well, kind of the point.

But I do absolutely see how someone could make the honest mistake of thinking that fully cooked=hot. And I agree with the previous poster who said that another term like \"ready to heat\" might clear up some confusion.

Also, the overzealous reheating instructions must be a liability thing. It would be very dangerous to partially cook and then cool a turkey--I'm sure the bird was, in fact, fully cooked.

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TechnoDestructo
November 24, 2009 2:34 PM
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If she had explained her situation adequately, the employees should have mentioned it was cold. From her description, it doesn't sound like the Publix employees had any reason to think there was a problem.

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StrangeEmily
November 24, 2009 3:06 PM
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I feel pretty bad for the manager too, but he should have put up a sign on the counter so that a majority of people might have read it when the employees forgot to mention the fact that the turkeys wouldn't be hot. Even more importantly so to have the sign since the daily meetings didn't work.
The employees sound like they've long had enough of the place they work at, and they assume that customers should know everything that they've been trained to know.

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BuddhaLite
November 24, 2009 3:18 PM
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What's next? Are we going to have to put those warnings on frozen meals? Does this person expect Publix to take the turkey out of the oven as soon as she arrives too? They didn't make her look like a fool. She did that herself.

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henrygates3
November 24, 2009 3:18 PM
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I think they should warn customers. I saw an ad in the paper for these precooked turkeys and even in the ad it said they are delivered cold.

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neoeinstein
November 24, 2009 3:21 PM
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Hot dogs come \"fully cooked\", but are certainly refrigerated. Similarly, breaded chicken tenders are \"fully cooked\", but they are a frozen product. This is a case of misplaced expectations on the consumer's part. There are a lot of issues with even packaging for taking home (juices, leakage, etc.) of a turkey still warm enough for the FDA standard internal temperature (~160 F, I think).

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CyGuy
November 24, 2009 3:35 PM
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How much company time did the OP spend on not going with Boston Market? I sounds like she spent about $30 and expected $100 worth of catering. She should have gone with Boston market, or she should have printed up a spec sheet that requested a formal quote on a \"Fully-cooked, ready to carve, hot turkey\" from both places.

The fact she spoke to 3 employees is emphasized over and over, but this is a supermarket deli, not the Four Seasons. They don't have some system in place to track all your customer contacts. Now some supermarkets (like larger Wegman's stores) have catering departments that will handle you just like any other catering company, but expect to pay $10-$25 per person just like you would with any other caterer. You are going to get the same level of service ordering a single bird from the deli counter - that will get you treated like anyone else buying a pre-cooked turkey for the holiday meal.

And because I can't figure how to reply to a reply within a thread, i stick this in here as well. No reputable food preparation operation should every sell your a \"nearly cooked\" or \"Partially cooked\" turkey. that is salmonella outbreak waiting to happen. If the bird is not fully cooked, the uncooked part can infect the cooked part, and the whole bird must be heated back up to 180 before serving - which takes a considerable amount of time, and which will make the part that was already cooked close to inedible because it will be dried out.

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coren
November 24, 2009 3:56 PM
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If the deli manager says that the employees should have known better (he's siding witht he consumer) I'm gonna take him at his word..

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The Kwisatz Haderach
November 24, 2009 4:04 PM
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I too would have assumed it would be hot (which would be my error for assuming). I feel that while technically the store is not at fault, obviously it is an issue which has come up previously if the manager has to hold meeting requesting that his employees inform the customer what the temperature of the bird will be when they receive it. If it is that big an issue the store should make a sign, and require all those who wish to purchase the turkey verbally acknowledge that the bird will be cold when they get it. Should they have to? No, but it sure would save a lot of headaches for both the store and the customer.

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WSUCanuck
November 24, 2009 4:33 PM
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This lady pretty much failed. Fully cooked does not mean hot. Hot and fresh means hot. The thousands of thanksgiving dinners ordered at Safeway are fully cooked, but frozen. This is a convenience/liability issue as some people may not have the experience or the time to cook a turkey from raw to ready.

I am surprised that so many people agree with the letter-writer in saying that they should warn that Fully Cooked doesn't mean hot.

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godlyfrog
November 24, 2009 6:26 PM
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I'm one of those who sides with the store on this, but also thinks the store should have told her. The reason why is because you need to know your customer. If the people answering the phone initially had cared even a whit about their jobs, they would have picked up on what she was doing and held a conversation instead of just trying to get her off the phone so they could continue their march toward quitting time. Someone buying a \"fully-cooked\" piece of meat may not understand that there's a difference in the types of frozen meat you can buy. When I first learned to cook a ham, I didn't even know there was a difference between fully cooked and uncooked, but now it's second nature to look.

Having said that; Wendy is a bad consumer. She ordered something not understanding what she was ordering, then pointed fingers everywhere else when her expectations didn't meet what she was provided, despite the fact that she was provided exactly what she ordered. It's bad behaviour on her part as well as on the part of the store employees. In fact, the only person in this story who did anything right was the manager who tried to make it right by giving her chicken and pumpkin pies.

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dragonflight
November 24, 2009 6:08 PM
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The fact that she spoke with so many employees and this still happened lays the blame on the employees, for sure. I would've assumed it was at least fully cooked and at room temp, if not hot.

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A_smilodon
November 24, 2009 6:37 PM
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The way these things work the turkeys are cooked in industrial ovens by the supplier and then cooled and refrigerated for shipping. It would be a logistical impossibility to have them hot. I've never seen anyone sell these and without mention that they need to be re-heated.

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H3ion
November 24, 2009 7:28 PM
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Fully cooked means it has been cooked. Sliced turkey also is fully cooked. The OP should be grateful that Publix removed the feathers.

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Thumbmaster
November 24, 2009 11:23 PM
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There are plenty of food sold that are fully cooked but still cold. Cold cuts, for example. How about cocktail shrimp? Even fully cooked bacon. I think this post reminds us of the old adage about assuming...

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inogeni
November 25, 2009 12:37 AM
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I actually work in the deli dept for another large grocery chain, and so far this year we've had 3 people return their turkey dinner orders because they wernt hot.

On all signage, it clearly says that the meal is cooked, but given cold.
On every order form, it also says the meal is cold, including the re-heating directions for the turkey.

Every return, customers have admitted they didnt not *read* that teeny little fact.

Even if we wanted to server them hot, with the 50+ orders we got this yea, there is no way we could've *safely* kept that many orders warm for pickup.

I feel so sorry for that publix manager.

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baquwards
November 25, 2009 12:55 AM
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We sell similar dinners where I work, and it has been drilled into our heads to tell people that they are fully cooked and cold, ready for them to heat themselves.

Even then people don't listen and freak out when picking them up even when I told them myself that it would be cold.

In my experience people rarely pick up orders when they say they will, we could have an order hot and ready to go for a 10:00 order only to have the customer show up at 12:00 and we have no way to keep all of that hot, especially for multiple customers.

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ShinGetterPoPo
November 25, 2009 1:54 AM
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Fully cooked should mean two things:
1) You don't have to put it in the oven for 90-120 minutes at 350 degrees. That would be cooking it.
2) If you request a fully cooked turkey, then it should be fairly obvious that you want it hot. From what I saw in the story here I didn't see any indication of wanting a cold turkey. She made sure to let the store know that it was for a business, therefore they are not going to want to cook/reheat a large turkey at work.

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CTAUGUST
November 25, 2009 8:59 AM
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First, if the OP had a job doing events at Walt Disney World she should know \"fully cooked\" does NOT mean \"hot\".

This was entirely her error and I am suprised the Consumerist staff does not come right out and say that. She also seems more interesting in writing a dramatic 10 paragraph saga about this than realized she should have asked and moving on.

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Tito151
November 25, 2009 9:36 AM
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I wouldn't expect it to be hot upon arrival, but then I am used to food service. They're probably trying to avoid any food-borne illnesses by cooking it fully, but serving it cold. That and any turkeys that they do not sell, if kept cold, can be donated to a food shelter.

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mmmsoap
November 25, 2009 9:47 AM
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\"Fully cooked\" and being given instruction for reheating are not mutually exclusive events, and being told how to reheat something doesn't imply that it's not fully cooked. Granted, I haven't seen the label, but the OP's description implies to me \"eat it cold if you want to, but to warm it thoroughly throughout, heat it this way...\"

While I do understand the OP's frustration, this seems like a communication error and not maliciousness or fraud on the attempt of Publix. Frankly, including the words FULLY COOKED in all caps does not sway me to her point of view.

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schernoff
November 25, 2009 10:45 AM
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Another vote for \"fully cooked does not equal hot\". I'll call it a customer service fail on Publix's part for not communicating that to Wendy, if she did in fact tell them she wanted it for an office lunch. But also a fail on Wendy's part for not asking the simple question \"this will be ready to serve, right?\"

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girly
November 25, 2009 11:24 AM
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Refrigerated leftovers are fully cooked.

Now if it was in the context of catering, maybe I'd expect 'fully cooked' to mean hot. But it sounds like the deli was just a supplier, not a caterer.

So the fact it needed to be re-heated does not mean it's 'not done cooking' to me.

Looks like the should have gone with Boston Market.

Or just gotten some sandwich fixings. Nothing wrong with cold turkey sandwiches.

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girly
November 25, 2009 11:59 AM
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Yes they should warn customers the food is cold, but I don't think the store is entirely to blame here.

It doesn't sound like they actually catered the event, just supplied food.

Even refrigerated leftovers are 'fully cooked'

In the context of catering I would expect cooked items to be hot. But it sounds like the OP was just buying the food and supplies from the store.

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girly
November 25, 2009 12:04 PM
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Ahh, didn't see the other one took. Sorry

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allthatsevil
November 25, 2009 1:28 PM
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So, we've established that \"fully cooked\" does not necessarily mean hot and ready to eat.

That aside, not only did more than one employee know it was for a work function (where they most likely wouldn't have an oven, nor would anyone want to cook it at home and then transport it to work), but the deli manager had been telling them every day to inform customers that the turkeys are cold. That alone puts them at fault.

When Thanksgiving comes around they are going to be overwhelmed with turkey orders, yes. But that means there's a greater chance for misunderstanding and they should be prepared to handle that. It should be common practice to inform customers of something like that, especially around holidays when they're getting tons of orders for it. In most retail environments it's pretty safe to assume that customers are morons and need their hands held. Even if they don't, no harm done.

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Carlee
November 28, 2009 12:31 AM
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I would expect someone who plans events to be a bit more detail-oriented. I have to order catering for my bosses occasionally (I hate it and luckily it is not a big part of my job) and when I do, I always ask about everything because I'm afraid they'll deliver the wrong food, be hours late, or whatever else could go wrong.

I'm not familiar with Publix (they don't have them out here), nor do I order food from delis. Sure, the deli employees could have asked \"you are aware that the turkey is cold, not hot, right?\" but seems that the signage never stated the turkey was hot or ready to serve. Ready to eat or fully cooked doesn't mean it is hot.

Just because the OP was ordering the turkey for a work lunch doesn't necessarily mean the deli employees should know she wanted a hot turkey. Some lunch/break rooms have stoves/ovens (though one big enough for a turkey?) or someone could always heat it up at home and then bring it in to work.

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johnnya2
November 29, 2009 3:18 PM
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1

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johnnya2
November 29, 2009 3:21 PM
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The big problem here is a matter of definitions.Saying you were a planner at Walt Disney should fill you on on certain terminology. \"Fully cooked\", does not equal \"ready to eat\"

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