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idip
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I think in this situation it would be best just to leave to avoid what's going on right now.

If though she wanted to pay, the items she had were still WalMart property.

Do stores still reserve the right to refuse service? If so, being asked to leave is enough to get you to go.

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4 replies
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volcomvenom
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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She could have just shop lifted and if she got caught she would have saved 5,474 days in prison! @idip:

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sonneillon
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@idip: I don't know about stanthemandeans 16th amendment argument, but a store can refuse service to anyone as long as they are not a protected class. You can refuse service because they are wearing wight after labor day or you just do not like the person if that makes you happy, but since that tends to make your managers unhappy and might make you unemployed it is perhaps best to avoid just kicking people out.
[en.wikipedia.org]

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RogerTheAlien
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@sonneillon: First off, probably shouldn't use Wikipedia as a \"legit\" source. Ever.

But I digress; just because a store/restaurant/customer-service-based business has a sign saying they have the right to refuse service to anyone, doesn't necessarily mean they do. A lot of restaurants have these signs because it allows them to kick-out patrons that are recognized as past dine-and-dashers. However, a lot of things can move from legal realms to civil realms. So, if a store DOES refuse service, they'd better have a pretty cut-and-dried case as to why they did so. And even if they avoid legal proceedings, they'll still have a potential lawsuit brewing for any number of reasons thought up by the refusee. So, it would behoove all customer-service businesses to be sure they're making the right call on refusing service.

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sonneillon
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@RogerTheAlien: Yes I cannot use wikipedia in my MBA classes, but this is the internet and I needed a summery and did not want to spend more than 3 minutes doing it and it was not even the main point of my shpeal only backround information about protected classes.

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StanTheManDean
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@idip:


Absolutely, store have and do refuse service. Service=labor (or a task performed) and the 16th Admendment forbids slavery and servitude. Being reguired to perform a service (above and beyond the call of duty or what is provided to other customers) without proper compensation is the same as slavery.


Refuse service can be for other reasons. Health and safety of employees or other customers is a very valid reason.

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WonderKatGoBoom
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Protocol would be to glance at the person you'd be cutting in front of and motion that you'd like to join your companion in line. If it's just a few items, I wouldn't mind being allowing someone to cut in.
I'm young-looking and small, and in the South. My biggest problem with line cutters are when another lane opens and the last person in the next line jumps in, instead of allowing those who had been waiting longer. I also have experienced the elderly blanantly cutting in line, as if they have earned it.
I generally let it slide. I avoid Wal-Mart, and Target seems to always have another open lane.

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16 replies
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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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My biggest problem with line cutters are when another lane opens and the last person in the next line jumps in, instead of allowing those who had been waiting longer.

@WonderKatGoBoom: I hate this especially since all the cashiers around here seem to think that's how it *should* work. They'll tell the person that just got in line that to go to come over to the register they just opened while I've been standing there for forever behind the person with 100+ groceries and all possible forms of payment.

The one time it would have gone in my favor I told the woman ahead of me to go to the line that just opened up.

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bohemian
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@WonderKatGoBoom: I have had the same elderly entitlement problem. Really rude behavior does not get excused just because you have a few decades on me. I always have to wonder if these people were rude, inconsiderate boobs when they were young.

Most of the rude line cutters I have experienced are middle aged women.

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steveliv
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@WonderKatGoBoom: personally i think that when new lines are opened, it is first come first served. simply waiting in line in another register, doesn't entitle you to a better spot in a newly opened line just because you have been waiting longer.

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RogerTheAlien
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@steveliv: The onus falls on a well-trained clerk at a well-operated store to ensure that the checker opening the new line tells the person next in line at an already-full checkout line to come to the newly opened one. Stores that don't train to this standard are not worthy of my patronage. And, I've made a point to tell customer service that they need to retrain their clerks. If I come back the next time, and the same thing happens, I talk to the manager, make a comment as to my displeasure, and tell them I'm shopping at such-and-such down the street from now on.

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korybing
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@WonderKatGoBoom: Same. I never mind letting someone in if they're polite about it, and especially if they have fewer items than I do. A little politeness goes a long way.

And even if they weren't polite and just cut in, I hate confrontation so much that the worst I would ever do to them is just glare at them. Someone cutting in front of me in a check-out line isn't worth getting upset about in the grand scheme of things.

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zandar
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@WonderKatGoBoom: In danger of not adding much to the discussion, but...

\"Protocol would be to glance at the person you'd be cutting in front of and motion that you'd like to join your companion in line.\"

absolutely correct, in my mind. if you want to cut, explain yourself. Like you, I'm likely to go for it if it's just a few items.

Anybody who cuts and thinks the person behind them wouldn't care is presumptuous and selfish. Anyone who cuts and doesn't care what the person behind them thinks is a jerk, plain and simple.

Decorum, people! It's what makes humans special. At least we have the capacity...

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DangerMouth
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Well, if it's just you in line, and you allow someone to go ahead of you, that's fine. But if you are in a line with others behind you, you have just made the same presumption and demonstrated the same lack of consideration for the people in line behind you.

Anyone who thinks it's ok to allow a cutter in front of them should do the right thing and take the cutter's place at the end of the line. (when it's not just you in line)

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@zandar: It's funny yet elementary, isn't it? Once you include that \"I acknowledge that you are a person and have feelings\" bit it changes the whole tenor of the situation.

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MrEvil
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@WonderKatGoBoom: I got no problem letting someone's friend or party member cut in line at the checkout, so long as it's not 3 buggies full. And generally speaking that's not what you end up with anyway.

Oh, and earlier today my dad and I were patiently waiting for a lady to finish browsing the clearance section of the meat case at the grocery store. Only to have some old bastard jump right in and stand there for 15 goddamn minutes touching everything. What's worse is my dad's an old bastard himself.

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Loias calls you out if you can't RTFA
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@WonderKatGoBoom: Really? Targets near me have literally 20+ lanes and only ever open 3 regardless how many are in line.

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henrygates
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Loias: Same here. Even worse is Home Depot. After they installed the self checkouts, I've never seen any of the regular lanes open, except the commercial lane at the other side of the store. Just a few self checkout lanes and a glazed over cashier staring into space doing nothing.

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pecan 3.14159265
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Loias: The Target near my home always has at least six lines open. I've never spent more than a few minutes waiting in line.

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Kuchen
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: The Target I go to is really good about lines. Sunday afternoon is really busy there, and yesterday when I went, they had at least 12 lanes open and someone directing the shoppers to the less busy ones at the non-grocery side of the store.

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LMacConn
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@WonderKatGoBoom: I agree with this, if you just cut in, it is natural for the person to feel slighted, but if you motion first they will almost always be nice and let you.

I have not only experience the elderly blatantly cutting in line, but also clipping my ankles with their cart while I was checking out and telling me to get out of their way. Maybe that was appropriate behavior in the 1940s, but it isn't now.

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burnedout
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@LMacConn: I thought this only happened to me!! I've had elderly people PUSH me with their carts to move me away from freezer cases they wanted to look in. If it wasn't an old person I'd probably push back and say \"I think the words you're looking for are excuse me.\"

And line cutting - I haven't had this at the grocery store, but every time I'm in the pharmacy some old person either just cuts in line or yells at me to wait while they get their meds. It's insane!

Last one - what's with old people parking ACROSS multiple parking spaces?? If you can't get it between the lines you shouldn't be driving.

'kay, I'm done.

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holytrainwreck
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@burnedout: Hold up 3 fingers to their face, and exclaim, \"read between the lines\"!

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tonberry
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@burnedout: it's funny that they are in such a rush to get out of the store, and back on the road only to drive 20 mph under the damn speed limit. you would think that they would drive the fastest being that they have the least amount of time left!

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mamalicious
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@LMacConn: Apparently you have never cut in front of me. I guarantee that I would be NOT \"be nice and let you\".

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htowninsomniac
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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No, it's not cool to switch lines unless everyone in the back of the line agrees. I normally say \"the line ends over there\" and appreciate the store's support if the person who cuts in line doesn't relent.

Being forced to leave and banned from the store, regardless of whether she wants to pay or not, is adequate.

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lmarconi
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@admiral_stabbin:
Seriously? Is your one minute that valuable? If only you have a few items, and you're clearly joining a friend in line in front of me, whether you're paying separately or together, it does not bother me.

I'll admit that if somebody joined their friend and paid separately for a cart full of crap, I'd be a bit peeved. But if somebody joins their friend and buys a pack of gum, whatever. I have better things to be upset about. That one minute is not worth being irritated. Somebody who huffs at some kid who cuts with their friend and says \"the line is over there,\" most likely in an irritated and condescending voice, probably gets upset about a lot of little crap in life that isn't important in the general scheme of things.

On occasion, bf and I have been in line at the grocery store and I remember we forgot to get something, like a gallon of milk. I'll leave him there, I'll go and get the milk, and I'll jump back in line. I especially don't see a problem with that and I don't have a problem when other people do it. It's clear to those behind you why you jumped out of line and you didn't change the order in the end.

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admiral_stabbin
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@lmarconi: I'm confused as to where this \"one minute\" thing came in. I didn't mention an arbitrary time period in which it's OK to be rude to strangers...

I guess I'm the type that actively tries not to impose on other people...even if it is a complete stranger and only for one minute.

I'm also not the type to get upset by such behavior. I wrote above, \"I'd imagine anger is a common response.\". I meant that literally. My blood pressure is not affected by such common acts of rudeness...or even what I consider to be much worse (e.g. woman starts war dialing family members on her cell in front of me to find someone to transfer money since she can't foot the $20 in groceries she's trying to buy...I waited five minutes before I had to reload my cart and switch lanes).

What it boils down to (for some of us) is the lack of common courtesy that is this type of behavior. It's presumptuous to think that your forgetfulness for some milk is OK with the rest of the world because their time cannot possibly be important to them.

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coffeeculture
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@htowninsomniac: I switch lines so long as there is only one transaction occurring. It's like if your kid ran up last minute with a bunch of stuff while you're putting items on the conveyor belt.

I do this all the time at stores (usually Costco with long lines). I'll have a friend stand in line with our cart full of stuff and I'll hit up the pharmacy/snacks area nearby and grab stuff.

One transaction = ok. Straight cutting and turning it into two transactions = not okay.

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henrygates
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@htowninsomniac: I've said this a few times to line cutters but I've never had any store employees back me up.

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Rachacha
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@htowninsomniac: My wife and I will commonly hold a spot in two lines to scope out which line is moving faster, but we always make the selection on which line we pick well before we are ready to place the items on the belt. (Especially at Costco where there are usually 5 people waiting in line)


We can avoid all of this simply by setting up a single line que where customers wait until the next available register is open. This way, if one customer had issues with the transaction it has no impact on who is served next

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NewsMuncher
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@Rachacha: Fry's operates their cash registers this way (at least at the Fry's I've seen). So does Best Buy. You have a single queue line. At Fry's there's a little older lady (middle-aged and up - I've never seen a man or young woman) that directs you to wait until a new register opens up and scoots you along when it does. At Best Buy you get haloooed from the register.

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ShruggingGalt
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Rachacha: The commissaries on base did that in the 80s/90s....I think it worked well.

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Areia
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@ShruggingGalt: They were still doing it 4 years ago when I last went to one on a US base in the UK. Makes so much more sense. I think they even had someone at the front of the line telling people which register was open.

Then again, I had a guy get really angry with me at a CVS because I was the last remaining person in what had been an impromptu single line for three registers. He wanted to know which register I was waiting for, and when I told him there had been one line, so whichever one opened up next he started ranting at me. Apparently being the second person in a line was much worse than getting to guess which customer finish first.

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lmarconi
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Areia: Agree with you on the UK style queuing. I lived there recently for awhile and not only do lines move lightyears faster, but it takes away the opportunity for people to switch lines and cause issues.

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JPropaganda
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@htowninsomniac: The splitting of lines is completely fair game. You and a friend or relative wait in line and then go to the faster one. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it unless the person has an absurd shopping cart full of merchandise.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda: No, it is not fair game. What does knowing one of the people in line have to do with cutting in front of people? If you want to check out together then get in the same line.

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Amish Undercover
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda: Two problems with your reasoning.

(1) Other people choose which line to get into based on who is already in the line. You are screwing with everyone else when you cut into a line.

(2) Is it then okay for two of your friends to hop in? What about three friends? Where is the cutoff? Any cutoff is arbitrary, so if you say some cutting is acceptable, you have no logical basis to argue against a large number of people cutting.

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Saboth
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda:

Nope, sorry, don't agree. If it worked like that, then you could get a family of 12 and have them all in each line with items. Then one person is ready to be rung up, and all 11 of the other people have to gather up their items, force their way out of their lines, force their way back into their \"friend's\" line. Now...imagine if everyone in the place did this. And if you are putting people in the lines without items...then why are they in a line if they have nothing to buy?

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admiral_stabbin
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda: I disagree, too. How is attempting to game the proverbial queue system and causing other people to wait \"completely fair game\"?

It wasn't cool to cut when you were (hopefully) being taught how to stand in a line in Kindergarten.

It's even more uncool when you're an adult and play such games with your own arbitrary standards (e.g. \"There is absolutely nothing wrong with it unless the person has an absurd shopping cart full of merchandise.\"). If you get permission from the people you are cutting in front of, then it's completely fair game.

Personally, I don't care if you just need a pack of gum. It's still cutting in a line, and be ready for people to respond however they do when they feel cheated. I'd imagine anger is a common response.

I agree with FatLynn's comment that if you aren't purchasing anything that it's a 100% non-issue.

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holytrainwreck
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@admiral_stabbin: Everything people know should have been learned in Kindergarten. Like manners, especially.


Lack of manners is a societal scourge.

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The Porkchop Express
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda: unless they aren't paying together. if they are paying together and it's only a couple items, sure go ahead.

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anonymousryan
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda: It's not okay if you're going to make two separate transactions. If you join your friend in a line with people behind them and then pay all of it together that's fine with me.

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pecan 3.14159265
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda: I totally agree with this. In fact, the people who split lines are usually the people who don't have a ton of stuff. Who would split an entire cart of stuff just to get into two different lines?

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AbsoluteIrrelevance
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: I totally agree, whether or not everything is on the same receipt. If the next person in line is your friend, you will 1) move your transaction along faster so you can leave with your friend, 2) be more courteous and give your friend room to put things on the conveyor belt 3) your friend isn't going to waste time arguing prices or getting their card out because they are just as motivated as you to leave.

Splitting lines to find the fastest one is totally fair game.

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craptastico
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@AbsoluteIrrelevance: once you're at the conveyor belt, you're committed. it's too late when the person behind you already loaded their stuff on the belt

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FatLynn
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda: I disagree. If you and your friend/relative are checking out separately, you are adding a person to the line for everyone lined up behind you, and that is not fair.

Now, if you are not purchasing anything, and you get in one line while your friend is in the other, and she comes over when you get to the register first, that is fair game.

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pecan 3.14159265
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@FatLynn: I'm okay when it all goes on the same receipt. If it's two separate transactions, it's not okay, because it's not just the items, it's the extra time to pay for them.

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wgrune
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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\"Is it cool for someone to join their friend or relative in a faster moving line?\"


No. Unless you go to the end.

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9 replies
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Inglix_the_Mad
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@wgrune: Personally, I think it's rude but it isn't illegal. Nor should it be cause for all this drama.

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He
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@wgrune: If I walk up and hand somebody a CD or a pack of gum to check out with, would you object? What about 2 CDs? So long as it's not a whole cart packed to the brim, you should probably just chill out.

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YardanCabaret
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@He: This is reasonable. What was it that that study found out for checkouts. It's something like 17 seconds an item but something like 1.5 minutes per person. So if it's just a couple items being added to a pile it's no biggy. If its another sale transaction then that's just cutting and I will not stand for it.

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JPropaganda
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@wgrune: As I said above, I completely disagree. The splitting of lines is completely fair game. You and a friend or relative wait in line and then go to the faster one. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it unless the person has an absurd shopping cart full of merchandise.

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Saboth
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda:

If everyone followed this principle, the entire place would be in shambles, there would be broken bottles, etc as people squeezed in and out of lines continuously. The impulse buy items would be all over the floor, and every line would move 10x slower as hundreds of people moved in and out of lines continuously. It only works for the \"few\" people that think it is ok. Fortunately, the people with manners keep the place moving in an orderly manner.

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coren
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Saboth: I'm not sure where you shop, but I don't think I've ever been in even Walmart or Costco where I could describe the total amount of customers in the store as hundreds, let alone checking out.

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Cant_stop_the_rock
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda:

Have you considered that the 30 seconds you save by splitting lines isn't worth being rude to the people you're getting in front of?

I see people split lines around here, but as soon as someone gets in line behind them they get out of that line (because bringing the other person into that line would be rude).

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wgrune
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda:


The only way I would agree with that is if they are paying together. If they are paying separately, no, its not right.@He:

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@wgrune: And if they're paying together they should get in the same line in the first place.

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ktjamm
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda: The bottom line is it is rude. Regardless if its 2 or 200, you don't cut into lines without knowing that people will be annoyed.

otherwise this is just an exercise in determining \"acceptable\" annoyance.

Bottom line. Rude people will still cut, people in the line will still be annoyed. But it's nothing to lose sleep over.

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ben
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JPropaganda: I agree with this. But either way, it's certainly not worth making a huge deal about. So what, you'll have to wait an extra five minutes in line?

As to this specific incident, though, the woman's not entitled to shop there. If she was asked to leave the store, she should have, regardless of whether she \"wanted to pay.\"

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deniseb
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@ben: If waiting in line for an extra 5 minutes is no big deal, then why doesn't the line cutter just go to the end of the line?

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Porcupinesalad
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Doesn't sound like an issue with line cutting. It sounds like an issue with someone thinking they can do whatever they want in public and get away with it. The store has the right to refuse a sale to anyone. The store is also private property, they can ask anyone to leave at any time for any reason. No she shouldn't have been able to cut in line, no she shouldn't have argued with the manager when asked to leave, no she shouldn't have assaulted police officers while resisting arrest.

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4 replies
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Aisley
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Porcupinesalad:


Based on my personal experience, the bully that cuts in front of you in a line, will not care about anybody saying anything to them on their behavior. And there are some bullies out there that don't even care about getting down ugly with the police. If your line at the register moves slowly, well tough cookies! deal with it.

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jayphat
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Porcupinesalad: Not to fuel the flames, but after you are asked to leave, at least in Ohio, it's considered criminal tresspassing. That's a quick way to go to jail for something dumb IMO. Although, I've done that a few times in my career simply because people are causing a scene. I lol alot when they cops put the handcuffs on and tell them \"If you had left when they asked, this wouldn't be a problem\"

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boxjockey68
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Porcupinesalad: Yes, she was very rude while cutting in line, she broke the law when assaulting people, and resisting arrest. Too bad, so sad. You play you pay.

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rushevents
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@boxjockey68: I will NEVER understand why people freak out at the police.

I have a good friend that got into an argument with the owner of a wedding dress shop. It finally deteriorated into an \"Im not leaving without my refund!\" so the owner called the cops.
Everything was fine - my friends decided to leave once the cops arrived but then as they were leaving he yelled - Great police in this town! The best cops money can buy! (Add a little profanity for color)

He got to spend the afternoon downtown.

The cops had let him go. All he had to do was walk away but Nooooooo! Just gotta' get the last word in.

Moral of the story: be polite to the police and they will be polite to you. Work out any wrongs later at the proper forum.

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RPHP
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I think you mean on principle.

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1 replies
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nybiker
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@RPHP: I was looking to see if anyone else caught it.

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The_Red_Monkey
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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15 years in jail sounds about right for line jumping.

Its not ok to jump line but just hand your crap to your friend to pay for and then settle outside. That does not make everyone so angry.

So depending on what side is more true if she was resisting arrest I still think 15 years is too much considering the crime that she had committed to warrant an arrest.

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nstonep
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@The_Red_Monkey: 15 years is way too much. Maybe 6 months community service.

But then again...anyone that plays the race card after being a douchebag pretty much deserves at least a month in prison.

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Velifer
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@The_Red_Monkey: Wasn't there a Heinlein novel with a bit like that, someone was shot for line jumping and the crowd/jury decided it was \"murder in the public interest.\"

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Brontide
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@The_Red_Monkey:

This is a little clarification, she was arrested INSIDE the store for refusing to leave after creating a scene. She is facing a number of charges because she ended up resisting arrest and attacking 2 of the officers. Walmart has security footage so I'm having a hard time believing that officers would just make up the chain of events.

[www.dddnews.com]

The officer explained in the affidavit that once it became \"abundantly clear\" that the subject had \"no intention of cooperating\" with police, she was informed that she was being placed under arrest. At this time, the officer struggled to place handcuffs on Ellis because she became even more combative, according to police.


The affidavit indicates that Ellis' refusal to comply with the arrest resulted in two additional officers coming to the arresting officer's aid. Ellis was described by these officers to be swinging, fighting, and kicking throughout the incident, while the three officers attempted to place her in handcuffs.

According to the court document, during the incident, Ellis reportedly kicked one of the officers, prior to striking a second arresting officer in the mouth. Once subdued, Ellis was transported to the Dunklin County Jail where she was processed, booked, and incarcerated.
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econobiker
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Brontide: \"Walmart has security footage so I'm having a hard time believing that officers would just make up the chain of events.\"


While the police probably have what ever footage that exists, please remember that Walmart's security cameras are to protect Walmart and its goods not necessarily the public from crimes or support criminal investigations.


Just saying...

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Brontide
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@econobiker: The attorneys have the tape, hers claim that \"no assault took place\" ( note how they don't dispute the other facts of the case ) and the prosecution is still proceeding with the case.

Her story stinks.

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Blackfished
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Brontide: I agree, and so does this one. I just finished up reading the story from [apnews.myway.com] and after seeing that, then reading this article, they grossly left much of the important information out. 15 years for cutting in line? No, 15 years for assaulting two police officers.

As an African American male, I couldn't be more tired of the \"race card\" being pulled up by other African Americans. It's incomprehensible to see skin color so often used as a cop-out for one's blatant disregard to society.

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holytrainwreck
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@Blackfished: Thank you. Thank you. And thank you again.


People are equal. Reverse discrimination is still discrimination. Whether you're black, white, red, blue or purple, bad manners is bad manners and assault and abuse is assault and abuse.

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god_forbids
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Blackfished: Ditto. I saw the article here first [www.foxnews.com] and was appalled at how unbalanced Consumerist's take was. To wit:

A college student in New Orleans at the time of her arrest, the 24-year-old Ellis now teaches in Louisiana, where she is engaged to a state trooper. She has said she feels trapped by \"small-town politics\" in Kennett, where her family lives.

\"What a shame the system can destroy a young person's future like this because of bad cops,\" Ellis wrote to the NAACP in April.

The group subsequently held a rally in Kennett. Before the June 13 event began, police officers found threatening letters the size of business cards scattered along the route that said the Ku Klux Klan had paid a visit and \"the next visit will not be social.\"

Dunklin County Prosecutor Stephen Sokoloff said the cards were removed and the source investigated but never discovered. He said he doubts the cards actually were from the KKK; he knows of no KKK presence in the area. A call to the KKK headquarters was not answered.

As for Ellis' allegations of mistreatment by law enforcement, Sokoloff said he's \"seen absolutely no evidence of any kind, apart from her statements, that those things occurred.\" Kennett Police Chief Barry Tate did not return phone calls seeking comment.

... She has previously rejected plea deals.

\"Why would you plea bargain if you're innocent?\" said Ellis' father, the Rev. Nathaniel Ellis of Kennett.

\"This is not a matter of justice,\" he said. \"It's a vendetta.\"

...Officer A.W. Fisher wrote in a probable cause statement that Ellis was given \"every opportunity\" to comply with officers and leave the property. He said she used an expletive in telling him she would beat him if he put his hands on her.

Fisher said he then told Ellis she was under arrest, but she would not stop fighting while being handcuffed.

Ah-hem. Obvious race-baiter is obvious.

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bhr
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@The_Red_Monkey: the 15 years isnt for the line cutting. Or even the (potential) assault on the other customer. Its for whatever happened outside with the cops.

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Jaynor
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I stand really uncomfortably close to line cutters in front of me... I'm 6'3\" and 300lbs. I like it if I can see the hair on the back of their necks move when I breathe.


I figure the awkwardness of that situation is punishment enough for their crimes.

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sonneillon
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Jaynor: As another 6ft 3 guy I must say that is brilliant, I am going to start doing that to line cutters from now on.

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lmarconi
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Jaynor: You know what, it's totally worth upping your blood pressure and making yourself irritated over something small like someone cutting in front of you.
Maybe it's just me, but IMO not sweating the small stuff can make you a lot happier in life.

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Jaynor
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@lmarconi: You misunderstand me - I find doing this hilarious. Doesn't hurt my blood pressure, just gives me a chuckle for the day.


In other news - I also enjoy standing facing the back if I'm the last person on a crowded elevator.

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H3ion
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Jaynor: The effect would mostly depend on whether you brushed your teeth this week.

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AK47 - Now with longer screen name!
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Jaynor: I love this idea, but I'm female and smaller, so I may have to resort to odd mumblings and humming to up the discomfort factor.

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Scuba Steve
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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You know, I might get annoyed if someone cuts in front of me in line, but honestly, I don't care. It's not a race. A fast cashier shouldn't even make it an issue. You just go through, and its over.


People are too uptight.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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It's not a race.

@Scuba Steve: Says the person who obviously doesn't have to catch a bus that only comes once an hour to get their groceries home.

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Cyberxion101
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Scuba Steve: It's the principle of the matter to me. I don't get indignant about it, but I wouldn't cut in front of someone who has been waiting in line, and I would appreciate the same consideration.


That said, I can't hold other people to my own standards.

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XTC46
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Scuba Steve: But sometimes it is a race. If im in a rush, I dont want to wait the extra 3 minutes for them to get through. And it seems that any time I allow anyone to cut, something happens. Their payment doesnt process, they need a price check, they need something that ends up taking much longer.


It's normally not a big deal, but the same logic that you are using to be ok with line cutters points out why they shouldnt cut to begin with. They think its ok to make me wait longer, but arent willing to wait longer themselves.

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WonderKatGoBoom
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@xtc46 - thinksmarter on twitter: This happened to me EVERY TIME I chose a short line at Wal-Mart.


Notice the past-tense... the \"value\" just isn't worth it to me anymore.

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proskills
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Scuba Steve: Thank you, I was looking for someone else to say this so I didn't. I do like Jaynor's way of dealing with this though, if I had another 75 lb I could do it too! :-P

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Razor512
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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It depends on what she did, if her cousin was on the other line and was close to the checkout (while like 20 people were behind her cousin) and she happens to join the line right behind her cousin, this this shows her as being a jerk and from my experience from students who do this at school on the lunch line, they are generally the more aggressive students who do this.

As for the police problem, there should be some surveillance camera footage, if not then it is her word against the police officers and guess who the courts are going to believe.

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frodolives35
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Razor512: I saw this on tv last night. When I googled it I found a blog that had some of her college classmates who described her as loud and obnoxious and known to cuss.The tone of the blog did not sound like an ax being ground and they were appaled at how far this has been blown out of proportion. The defendent is really playing up the preachers daughter angle akong with the race card. It really does seem like this should never have esclated to the police being called to begin with.

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NancyNally
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Razor512: I've seen this reported in so many media outlets as if it's a he said/she said story, and I don't know why no one has mentioned that - there should have been security cameras all over that store and parking lot that captured the whole thing. There wouldn't be audio to record the things she alleges were said but there should be enough video to tell if she was resisting arrest or if the police were justified in any force they used on her.

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RogerTheAlien
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@NancyNally: Agreed. That was my first thought. Additionally, it's almost impossible to discuss this case on Consumerist without brining the racial issue into play. The outocme of this trial is based solely upon the woman's actions with the police and her actions in the store. Normal line-jumping would not incur such purported wrath.

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sickyd
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I think it is fine to have two people from the same party hold different places in line so that they can check out the fastest. Let's face it, some cashiers are just plain slower than molasses and the time saved is huge especially when there are long lines. But if the lady, or whoever, is going to add another, separate party to the line by \"joining her companion\" then that isn't fair, no matter how many or few items she has.

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deniseb
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@sickyd: In other words: your time is important, but the time of the people you get in front of isn't. Way to go.

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SadSam
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@deniseb:


I'm not a fan of line cutting and I'm not a fan of people in general these days since so many are just plain rude. I don't shop at Wal-Mart, in part, to avoid these people.


But if I'm the last person in the line and someone wants to join their party I am normally agreeable because I want to be nice and kind to people and hope that they will be nice and kind to others . But if I'm not the last in the line I don't think I can waive the line jumping on behalf of the entire line - who knows what kind of rush they are in.

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Hobz
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@sickyd: I completely disagree with this. The reason being is that the people behind the line holders may have chosen that line based on what the others ahead of them were going to check out.

Eaxmple: Customer A and B (wife and husband) go grocery shopping. Customer A waits in one line with a cart full of groceries, Customer B waits in another with a pack of gum.

Now when I go grocery shopping, I don't usually check out in the shortest line. I look for the line with people carrying the least amount of items. How would you feel if you waited in line to check out and a woman with a cart full of food jumped in line because her husband was holding her a spot?

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Kimaroo - 100% Pure Natural Kitteh
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Hobz: That is exactly what I was thinking too, I don't see how that would be fair.

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HogwartsAlum
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Kimaroo - Fortified with Kittydus Purrularis: It's NOT fair. Cutting is rude. People have no manners anymore. The woman assaulted two police officers; that's why she's going to prison. Hope whatever cheap Walmart shit she wanted to buy was worth it.

I don't feel well today and have no sympathy for her. None.

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pecan 3.14159265
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@HogwartsAlum: Sorry you don't feel well. :( Feel better, though. Chicken soup?

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JPropaganda
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@sickyd: Thank you! Explained much better than I attempted to in responses above.

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Daveinva
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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\"Leaving alleged racism/police brutality/possible extended prison sentence out of it, what's the right way to handle line-cutters\"

Jump them in the parking lot.

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3 replies
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mac-phisto
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Daveinva: looks like the situation was handled properly then.

nothing to see here, folks!

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diasdiem
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Cutting in line with a friend or family member in the checkout line? No big deal. Since being able to easily move to another line means they don't have that much stuff, it doesn't add much to my wait. Cutting in line to buy something that has a limited quantity, though, like concert tickets or a newly released video game or console, is asking for violence.

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pulsar0510
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@diasdiem: But I don't feel that way, so why should you be able to make that choice for me if you're ahead of me on line?
The 15 years should be for the line cutting and then whatever they want to give her for hitting the cops.

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mac-phisto
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@diasdiem: or cutting in line for rollercoasters. that's not cool either. & no, it's not alright that you had 1 person stand on line for your party of 10. get to the back of the g-damn line or i'll bust your mug.

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diasdiem
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@mac-phisto: And why the hell does the guy in the wheelchair get to go straight to the front? It's not like he even has to stand!

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Loias calls you out if you can't RTFA
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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If the items go on the same receipt, then generally it should be okay. Usually a friend isn't willing to pay for 30 items, just one-two, and the time lost by others is minimal.


That being said, if someone cuts and you're not cool with it, a polite \"I'm sorry, you must not have seen me here. There's actually a few other people already waiting in line for this register\" will suffice.

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craptastico
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Loias: it should suffice, but apparently it didnt since it escalated to a confrontation with the police. you're assuming everyone's civil, which obviously wasn't the case here

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Loias: Even to the point where you're pushing somebody's items back on the conveyor belt? That to me is pushing it in more ways than one. I do, however, agree with you completely that the correct response is a polite objection, not shoving somebody, yelling, or whatever. The way to win the moral battle is to avoid those things, even if it means somebody else--gasp!--pays for their items before you.

I don't mind if you're in line together and one of you is coming up late with the milk or whatever, but actual line-splitting? Nah, tacky. But I think we need a Consumerist poll on this!

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Micromegas
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Loias: I doubt it would suffice in Walmart. It's more likely to get you a punch in the face and loud, suggestive comments about your sexuality.

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jaya9581
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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It depends how much of a hurry I'm in. I usually will say something directly to the person, though. I always start out nice: \"Oh, I'm sorry, there's a line. It starts over there\" and then see what happens. No swears, threats, or physical contact though. I've never had a real confrontation - the closest I ever got was some teenager going \"Whatever, let's go outside, I'll kick your ass.\" When I said sure, and took a step toward the door, she got scared and ran away. :)

I also enjoy loudly talking to my companions about how rude it is to cut, etc. It amuses me more than anything else, and watching the cutter get offended is far more satisfying a feeling than convincing them to go to the back of the line.

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Cyberxion101
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@jaya9581: That's what I tend to do on the off chance that I'm bothered enough by it to speak up. The cutter's reaction makes it more than worth the slight delay. :P

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dmolavi
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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you do what they taught you in school (she's a schoolteacher..) - you have to go to the end of the line, because all those other people were there before you.

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Hooray4Zoidberg
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@dmolavi: Right, also known as \"No cuts, no butts, no coconuts\"

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TheLemon
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Missouri is having a great day on Consumerist. Must be all that meth.

Cutting in line is never ok unless all the others in line agree. It's still rude though.

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korybing
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@TheLemon: Yeah I was just thinking that, hahah. This is like the third story mentioning my poor state today. Aw Missouri I luv ya baby.

It's rude to cut in line, but at the end of the day, it is not something I am going to lose sleep over.

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ecwis
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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It's only acceptable if you're both paying together and you can carry the additional items in your hands.

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pecan 3.14159265
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I do this, and I analyze people's behavior. In particular, I avoid the elderly, the hagglers and the indecisive buyers. With regards to what they're buying, I avoid lines in which people are carrying a lot of produce (this ensures a lot of book flipping and inputting of numbers) or very pricey electronics (sometimes this requires a cashier to override the system).


Usually when we split up and go to different lines, it's because one person gets into a line and the other person scouts ahead to see whether there are better lines. Usually I'm the scouter because I've gotten pretty fast about looking at who is in what line and what stuff they carry.


The ideal person to get behind is the younger lone male who has only one or two items. They don't tend to haggle on price as much, and they are usually very resolute on their purchase (it's not hinging on price). I don't like being behind friends in groups because they tend to talk to one another. Couples are okay.

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7 replies
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varro
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: Marge: \"But that line's the longest!\"
Apu: \"All pathetic single males. Cash only, no chitchat.\"

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sonneillon
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: Also certain stores have faster check outs than others. Walmart takes a long time to get through their lines no matter who is in line although they are getting better, while Costco I have seen a brick of people checked out in 10 minutes. Target is a mixed bag.

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BoraBora
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: I do the same. Though I would add families with small children to the list of people to avoid queuing behind.

Also applies to parking: a single male will get in his car and out of a spot much faster than families and groups of friends.

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DangerMouth
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: lol, because couples, once past the groping-in-public stage, don't actually have much to say to each other?

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pecan 3.14159265
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@DangerMouth: No, it's that a couple's interests align - we have to get out of this store, we need to go home and make dinner. Individuals that make up a group of friends may not have such a cohesive goal. We (the group) may need to make that 8 pm movie, but I need my Red Vines to sneak into the theater.

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DangerMouth
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: I knew what you were saying, it just sounded funny :)

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nbs2
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: Who needs the Kwik-E-Mart? Not Meeeee.....!

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elleeldritch
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: I like how you've got this down to a science. But I do the same thing so...

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duckfat
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I don't like Walmart and try to never shop there but this case has nothing to do with Walmart. It seems like some people got into an argument and Walmart did the ONLY sensible thing by calling the police and having the people removed. They chose to fight the cops and others and thereby got some charges. This should not even be on Consumerist. I know we all like to bash Walmart but where are they at fault in this at all?

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morganlh85
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@duckfat: Nowhere in the article do they really say Walmart is at fault here. In fact, the article seems to point more to the police officers as the wrongdoers in this situation.

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formergr
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@duckfat: In no way does this Consumerist post bash WalMart (for once!). Instead, it's using the incident as an introduction for a philosophical question about shopping behavior-- in this case, line cutting specifically.

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PsiCop
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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If stores properly constructed their cashiering lines -- i.e. by having a single queue leading up to all the registers, with customers peeling off to go to different registers as they become available -- this wouldn't be as much of a problem as it is now. Having multiple lines moving at different speeds only encourages people to shift from one to another if they perceive another is moving faster. A single queue eliminates that incentive.

If they can do this in banks, in Wendy's, at the Yankee Candle flagship store, and in other places, then they can do it in Wal-Mart, Kmart, grocery stores, and everywhere else. It's really just a matter of whether the store wishes to do it or not. Many wish not to, because a single long queue is more apparently intimidating to shoppers. This is, of course, merely an appearance. In reality a single queue is much more inherently \"fair\" and therefore more respectful.

Granted, a single queue won't prevent outsiders from trying to jump in. But it's easier to prevent this when you have only one queue; you can put up barriers or have it watched, etc. Multiple queues are much harder to control and observe.

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OneBigPear
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@PsiCop: The WalMart nearest to me has this sort of set-up and it works pretty well... I don't go that often, but it seems like a good solution for them.

And, cutting in is rude but 15 years seems crazy. Without knowing the full story I respect that she's willing to stand by her principals and not take a plea.

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consumerd
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@PsiCop:

Acutally there is a garden ridge near me that has this type of construction. There is one big line and they have it written to \"Wait here for the next available cashier\". So if there is one working faster than the others or hitting small items, the whole line moves faster.

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Kuchen
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@PsiCop: This is what they do at the Joann Fabrics I shop at. The line always looks long, but moves really fast. Most of the line is bordered by display racks (so they can still get you to purchase those impulse items), but one side is just a chain. On only one occasion have I had someone cut in front of me by going under the chain. That was a particularly busy pre-Halloween sale day, and at least 3 people pointed and said \"The end of the line is down there.\"

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ecwis
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@PsiCop: I don't understand how that would work when there are 20 cashiers or so and about 100 customers. It would take up much more space.

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scootinger
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@ecwis: Fry's stores have a setup like this, typically with several dozen registers (although usually probably 10-15 are open), and it seems to work completely fine.

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ecwis
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@scootinger: I'm sure the single line idea is great for some stores but Walmart is set up to allow hundreds, even thousands of people to shop at once. The single line system may work when the Walmart isn't very busy. But when it's packed, like during pre-hurricane stock-ups and such, I honestly don't think it'd work well.

If they put everyone in corrals, then the people in the line would have to walk the width of the Walmart as they progress in the line. The line of cashiers is pretty long so it's be a lot of walking back and forth.

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PsiCop
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@ecwis: They'd cluster the registers closer together. Having them widely separated with space for multiple lines, is at least as space-hogging as implementing a single queue.

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ecwis
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@PsiCop: At Walmart, the lines are already as close together as they can be. They would have to create more space so there would be somewhere for the line to form. This idea would work well if nobody had shopping carts but they do and it takes a lot of extra space.

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Veeber
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@ecwis: The airport seems to be do this just fine. If we stack everyone perpendicular to the registers it shouldn't be that bad. In your example each cashier should on average be 5 deep. Five shopping carts in a line, plus the surrounding people would block the lanes the same way.

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amhorach
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@PsiCop:
This is spot on. Ecwis, you're thinking about the space a single line would take up under the current register design in these stores, which is engineered to have a line behind each one. If they were to design them for a single queue, the registers could be closer together and the space saved there would be the staging area for the queue.

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nbs2
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@amhorach: I just fear that we would end up with the Best Buy Maze of Doom. The local BB went from 10 lanes to three in making the shift. I suppose it isn't that drastic, since they really just went from three open lanes to two. Nevertheless, the store within a store that is their impulse purchase area is exhausting.


With a grocery store or WM, or other high volume store, I think this would be more difficult. You need sufficient space for a cart full of goods, as opposed to a few items. Additionally, the current model is more accomodating of express purchases, by presenting all lines as equally long rather than one extra long line and a shorter express queue.

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DangerMouth
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@nbs2: Maze of Doom! Stores like Borders books, and Home Goods seem to have this down to a science, presenting an exhausting array of impulse crap as you snake your way around. I wonder how this has affected their bottom line?

I also wonder about how it works with the volume volume differences, because in a supermarket, you're generally unloading a cartload full of crap. This takes time, so you have to start *before* the usual \"I can help the next person\" timing.

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pecan 3.14159265
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@nbs2: I love the Best Buy Maze of Doom! I don't even mind when it's Christmas and the line is so packed with people because I like that I don't have to walk up and down the store looking for a shorter lane.


But you still have to deal with cutsies. It's just that there's actually someone there who monitors the line.

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PsiCop
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@nbs2: The idea of \"express lanes\" is a maladaptation meant to artificially preserve the multiple-queue setup. It adds apparent efficiency by peeling off queuers with fewer items into separate lines for smaller transactions. But if you've ever been in a store where most of the customers are buying just a couple items each and all end up in the \"express lane,\" leaving the others underused, you see that this actually introduces potential inefficiencies.

In those cases, the scheme backfires and makes things worse, not better.

The fact is that a single queue is overall more efficient for everyone ... cashiers AND customers. It maximizes use of each register and optimally moves customers to them. This will benefit everyone ... those with a few items as well as those with many.

If you're having a hard time imagining it, remember that, with large-transaction customers mingled in with small-transaction customers, this means that some of those transactions will be completed more quickly than others. This increases turnover time, again, for everyone.

It only backfires at moments when there's along sequence of people with large transactions who fill up all the registers and occupy them for a long time, with a single person with a small transaction waiting behind them. The odds of this happening would be small, depending on the register capacity. (If there are only 2 open registers it could be frequent, but if there are 10, it would be rare indeed.) But there are ways that stores can deal with that too, if they wish ... they could divert those people, say, to the customer-service desk, when that happens.

Again, it's all a matter of whether the stores WISH to do this. They CAN, and it would serve everyone better if they did, and they CAN do it with the same space they have now ... but many do not WISH to do it.

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nbs2
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@PsiCop: In stores where there is a broad selection of people, that may be the case. But, the problem comes back to the WM/grocery store high volume retailers that also serve as convenience points. Those are the locations where I suspect that the backfire scenario you present would occur on a regular basis.


In a store like JoAnn's, I suspect that the majority of purchase quantities fall within a narrow range of items.


At a grocery store/WM, you have a larger floor plan that encourages purchasing of a larger variety of items, but the price competition that make the store a lower priced alternative to 7-11/CVS. This attraction of extremes wouldn't be a problem if purchasing was spread out evenly. However, with the majority of purchases being actual grocery purchases, you end up with the majority skewing towards high volumes. As more folks hit the high volume threshhold, the express lane folks are stuck. Self checkouts appeared to have been an attempt to cut costs as well as cater to low volume purchasers (would you devote 3 aisles of self checkout with \"10 item or less\" tags otherwise?). However, those line have been taken over by high volume purchasers attempting to escape from longer lines, just as they did when the express lanes were born.


Shunting people off to customer service is a viable option, but you then need to balance the actual service issues with those who have abandoned their place in line (if they have not been trapped by the line).


I think the Maze of Doom is viable in the right location, but it is not an ideal solution for high volume retailers. It is too easy for low volume folks to get stuck.

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PsiCop
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@nbs2: The problem is that multiple queues do not serve customers well ... not in ANY setting ... no matter the transaction size.

The cold hard fact is that an alternative is needed. A single queue IS that alternative. Leaving things as they are, WILL NOT help. Lines WILL NOT magically improve if stores do NOTHING to change how they work. There is no \"line fairy\" who will show up someday and *poof* make the lines go away.

One definition of \"insanity\" is doing the same thing repeatedly, expecting different results. If this is the case, then continuing to use multiple queues is \"insanity.\" That's right. I said it. It is INSANE. Period.

I very much understand the resistance to this. I do. Honest. I get it. Really. I know it appears counterintuitive. I know it looks daunting.

But the key words on those two sentences are \"appears\" and \"looks.\" That's all it is ... an appearance only.

The reality is that a single queue is the most efficient way to go in every case. It just is.

If you don't believe me, try this real-world example reported in the New York Times:

The single-line, bank-style system was quickly chosen for its statistical efficiency. Then, Whole Foods paired the system with possibly the largest number of registers in the city, more than 30 per store, and it hired an army of cashiers to staff them throughout the day (including \"floaters\" to fill in for those who need a break).

The result is one of the fastest grocery store lines in the city. An admittedly unscientific survey by this reporter found that at peak shopping times - Sunday, from 4 p.m. to 6 p.m. - a line at Whole Foods checked out a person every 4.5 seconds, compared with 19.6 seconds for a line at Trader Joe's.

It simply works better. If more stores would try it, they'd find that out ... and you'd see it for yourself.

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ElPresidente408
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@PsiCop:
I completely agree that a single queue line is much more efficient. However you also have to consider space restrictions. Whereas a Wendy's customer may be able to navigate a zig-zagged line, try bringing a shopping cart into that maze.

Ironically when you'd benefit from a single-line the most (ie Labor Day weekend sale at Walmart), is also when you have the most traffic and least amount of space.

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@amhorach: I'm another who'd vote for those. They're not likely to be faster, but they're definitely irritation-reducers, which is much more important. It's sometimes a little helpful when stores point you to a line with no waiting in the old system, but it's so random that it doesn't achieve the fairness/irritation-proofing goal.

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coren
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@floraposte: I'm not sure about irriation reducers - instead of one line with a couple customers and one checker to annoy me, it's now 20 checkers and 40 customers all annoying me and why can't they go faster and oh god it's the DMV all over again and I'll just go curl up in a ball now

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nybiker
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I'll second (or third) the comments about \"if it's on the same receipt, all well & good.\"

Otherwise, it's the same problem as drivers who think nothing of racing ahead in the cash-only lane and then cutting into the E-Z pass lane. WTF, like I enjoy paying my tolls and waiting for my turn? You can wait 1/4 mile back like I was.

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self-check
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Consider these situations:

A: two strangers join at end of line.
B: two friends join at end of line.
C: first friend joins at end of line, and second later joins friend in middle.
D: two friends join at end of line, one friend leaves and later re-joins other friend in middle of line.
E: first stranger gets in line, and second later cuts in behind him.

E is the problem, and if socially accepted, it would become rampant.If are near the end of the line, why not just cut in earlier? Thus,anyone attempting E should be publicly shamed.

A and B are obviously acceptable, since they strictly follow therule of only joining the line at the end. C and D are the mainquestions. Both are similar to B, and probably not that common, thusallowing them wouldn't significantly impact one's average time-to-waitin lines. One snag is that C and D can look like E if the friends don'tinteract in a way that makes their relation obvious; others might seeit as a stranger cutting in. So anyone practicing C and D could be sureto make their relation obvious to others, by exchanging a few wordswhen one joins the other already in line.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@self-check: C is E. Anyone practicing C should stop being a jerk.

D is OK if they are checking out together and the person left because they forgot the milk or something. It's better than waiting until they reach the cashier to say they need to get something.

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madog
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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If it were a movie ticket line, or a soda line, or something similar that involves 1 item then I think buddy cuts is acceptable if both were there from the start. If the other party was running late and was having a place held for them in line then it is not acceptable.

If it's a line in a grocery store or someplace where each persons purchase can differ in amount then it is NOT acceptable. No, your 900lb friend in the crane can not join you in front of me in line to order 10 hamburgers, and not you can't have your friend cut in line with 20 grocery items just because you have 1 or 2. I hate you all. Please die.

That's mostly aside fom the allegations and facts we don't know about this particular case though.

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lalaland13
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I read the article earlier and don't remember seeing anything about store surveillance video, but I would think that might clear some of this up. Or maybe not.

As far as line-cutting, if someone handed their buddy some stuff to get for them, I might be a bit irritated but let it slide. If someone wants to cut in front of me and ring up two separate transactions, that would not be fine.

I don't know what I would say, if anything. Might just base it on the situation and the shopper and how mean they look.

I hope they can settle up something, because it sounds like both sides might have been at fault. No need for cops to get too aggressive, but she doesn't need to start kicking people.

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@lalaland13: My guess is that there is no surveillance video, since the event occurred in 2007 and nobody's brought it out yet. Pity, as it would help clarify things.

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humphrmi
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I once had an elderly lady ask me if she could go in front of me, since she only had a few items. Thing was, the express lane was completely empty and my items were already all on the belt, rolled up to the cashier. I politely declined and pointed out the express lane to her. Nice that she asked; kinda odd that she didn't just go to the empty express lane to begin with.

I see the sort of situation described in this story sometimes - two people shopping together, then at check-out time they split up and whoever gets the fastest line lets the other person cut in. It's rude.

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dijo10
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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It just doesn't matter when rude people are involved.


Personally, when I am in those lines, I have already wasted time shopping for whatever is in my cart, another 5 minutes will not affect me either positively or negatively. Life takes a long time to live. There are other battles to fight.

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JohnDeere
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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i only go to walmart at 5am. the wierdos are much cooler looking then.

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fate47 - Meh.
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Walmart has security cameras.

Cutting the line is neither against store policy nor the law, but if the lady was either 'actin' a fool' or the police were displaying racism, the tapes/witnesses should be able to verify/deny the statements of either party.

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Schmeeky
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I wouldn't mind letting someone cut in line in order to leave with their friend, except those people are the exact ones to fumble with coupons, require a price check, or pay by check. The act of kindness invariably backfires as the person you just let cut takes 2 or 3 times longer than anyone else to finish their transaction.

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Cyberxion101
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Schmeeky: Yup. That always seems to be the case here too. That's not too big a deal though. What really annoys me is when someone has a cart load of stuff and sees me standing there with maybe two or three items, but proceeds to unload their cart without offering to let me go first.


I always do it when someone behind me has less than I do, and it would be nice to get the same consideration every once in awhile. However it's been my experience that the folks in my neck of the woods are some of the most self-centered individuals that you'll ever meet. In fact I don't think that one person that I've allowed to go ahead of me has ever bothered to even thank me. I'm surprised that none of them have bothered to flip me off just to make it clear how little they care about anybody but themselves.

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WatchOutNow
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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'Go back to the ghetto' What the 'ell ?!?!?1?

WALMART is a ghetto! I h8 that place. Chalk 1 up for racism! !:YAY:!

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pecan 3.14159265
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@WatchOutNow: Everytime you neglect to write in properly spelled sentences, and use excessive exclamation points, God kills a kitten. We are not IMDB.

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JohnDeere
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: well every time god kills a kitten i want kitten stew. and you are correct, you are not imdb.

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CupcakeKarate
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@JohnDeere: Stewing is really the only way to prepare kitten. It's tough unless you cook it for hours. Puppy, on the other hand, is always tender and delicious.

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SatisfriedCrustomer
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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When I'm shopping with a friend, I usually get on line first, and then my friend puts on a red shirt and a name tag and walks to an empty cash register and yells \"Can I help the next person please!\" Everyone from in front of me usually zooms over to that new line, and while my friend pretends to \"just be logging in/setting up/etc. for a minute\", I pay, and then my friend and I run out of the store together. Saves loads of time.

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@SatisfriedCrustomer: Your friend should stay long enough to bag the items, and then leave with them. You're not maximizing the opportunity.

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Cyberxion101
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: Yeah, that was a little over-the-top, but I sort of find myself agreeing with the spirit of what he's saying just the same. @_@

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justsomeotherguy
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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What we have here is an irrational dipshit who ruined her own life. Cut in line, act like an entitled bitch, refuse to leave the store and cause a scene, and then assault the police... Her mother should have spent less time telling her she was god's gift and special and told her to to be nice to people. These are the sort of people who make life less livable for the rest of us. These trite jackasses who explode because their sense of entitlement is rebuked...

She should be caned and put in stocks to be publicly humiliated... Then I'm certain she'd learn the protocols of polite society. Prison will not rehabilitate this asshat, it will only mold her in ways what in the end will cost us all less.

But since that isnt an option... Well 15 years of prison rape seems fair to me for being a asshat.

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Brontide
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@justsomeotherguy:

[www.dddnews.com]

She is getting a trial for her irresponsible behavior that ended in resisting arrest and assaulting two police officers. There is footage of the event, but it's not been released publicly.

She deserves no sympathy and will be judged at trial by peers.

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justsomeotherguy
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Brontide: How was what I said uncalled for? She assaulted a police officer while throwing a temper tantrum. I'd rather see her caned to check her ego and then have her get on with life. But our legal system doesnt allow for this. What it does allow for is imprisonment with a strong chances of rape and a difficult future after release. I dont feel that's justice, or that it serves society in any useful way, but when I see some smug egomaniac getting any kinda beat down in a mess they created for themselves I cheer. Actions of consequences; dont do the crime if you cant do the time... And arent a fan of rape.

Maybe when I infringe on the rights of others, throw a temper tantrum, and then assault officers of the law I too will get my fair share of rape. Until then I will continue to choke on the freedom not being an egomaniacal asshat allows me.

We've all seen these types of people, and they come in all genres. We often wish a house or truck would fall on them. They suck the joy out of life. I have zero sympathy for them. Dont be dick, be considerate to others, realize you are not all that important.

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JohnDeere
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@justsomeotherguy: your the asshat, where can i sign you up for assrape?

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pecan 3.14159265
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@justsomeotherguy: Whoa, uncalled for. Totally, absolutely uncalled for!

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MeCatLikesMeHamSanwich
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I really have a hard time believing that police officers would make such comments as \"Go back to the ghetto\" in a public place with witnesses. Even if they had, which I doubt, fighting while being arrested will never, ever, help your case.

Don't bite my head off but this sounds like a case of crying racism to get out of the assault charges pending against her.

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savdavid
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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The woman cuts in front of others. This is a red flag of her respect of people. She refuses to move when asked by the store, another sign she thinks she is entitled to cut. She refuses to move when the police come, another sign of her arrogance. She resists arrest. A sign of stupidity. She claims \"outside\" she was told \"to go back to the ghetto\" and called \"racial\" names. Hmmmmm....who do I believe...she who says she did all of this \"on principal\" or people who patiently waited in line, the store staff or police officers? Not much of a call. This bitch is a liar.

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h3llc4t, breaker of office dress codes
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I hate it when people cut in. It just feels so rude to me: \"I'm with my friend so my purchasing requirements are more important than your time.\" If I'm out shopping with a friend and we split up, and his/her lane is moving faster, I join that lane at the end. Jumping in with a few small items bothers me less than an entire cart (which has been done to me multiple times, and I have politely let that person know that the line starts several people back) but still, it bugs me. We scout for lines, but don't get in one until we find one that looks good.

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The Cynical Librarian
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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This just sounds like an episode of Curb Your Enthusiasm.

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erratapage
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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No one in Minnesota cuts in line. No one wants to risk \"the look.\"


No one gives \"the look\" better than a Minnesotan. You know the look... the one that says you are a piece of organic detritous floating in a ceramic tank?


If someone does cut in line in Minnesota, it's someone from somewhere else who doesn't know how cold it can get here.


Or, maybe it's just that it has never happened to me here. If it did, I'd side with the majority here, and give \"the look\" when it looked like line cutter was going to cause a second transaction.

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@erratapage: Hmm, Midwestern data point? People don't do this in my area of Central Illinois, either. We do, however, do a lot of \"You've only got a few items, why don't you go ahead?\"

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Cyberxion101
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@floraposte: That sounds like paradise. I was raised to be polite, and I let people go ahead of me all the time, but I've never once had anyone offer to let me go ahead of them when I have a few items. Folks here in Santa Fe seem to be way too self-centered to make that sort of minor sacrifice.

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@Cyberxion101: I do think it's probably inversely related to population density. Seriously backed up lines are pretty unusual here, and we don't really do traffic jams either. So I don't think there's the big-city time pressure. (Don't worry, there are drawbacks as well.)

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burnedout
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@floraposte: \"(Don't worry, there are drawbacks as well.)\" Yup, like the corn. I'd give some of this Central Illinois corn for hills. That and a decent weather guy - I'm heartbroken that Chuck Collins went to WEEK. There's no justice in the world.

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self-check
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Why is it rude for two people to take different lines, then laterjoin in the line best? It would be as if they had joined the final linein the beginning; people in that line will wait just as long eitherway, and people in the other line will wait as long as if neither ofthe friends had joined it. And it's not like these friends are gettingsomething for nothing; for each minute that passes, they wait acombined two minutes. But the real reason I wouldn't care is that thisthing can't happen very often in comparison to the total number ofpeople served, thus a 100% successful elimination of the behavior viapublic shaming wouldn't yield much improvement.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@self-check: Because it's still cutting. Knowing the person you're jumping in front of doesn't change that.

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torgonius
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@self-check: When we go to Costco, as soon as we're near the end of our gathering, I'll go grab a spot in a line while my wife grabs the last of the stuff. Then she joins me in line.


And, if I manage to get to the register before she gets back, I let people cut past me til she gets there. Have never had an issue with it.

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@self-check: If it were as if they were in the line in the beginning, they'd have been in the line in the beginning. They weren't because it's not.

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Cyberxion101
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@self-check: Except that it's not like that at all, simply because, you know, they weren't in the final line in the beginning.


Which is the crux of the issue. If you weren't there in line from the start, then you don't suddenly get to appear out of nowhere like some sort of magical douche-bag, cutting in front of the folks who queued up properly like some sort of self-entitled cunt.

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halcyondays
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I'm willing to bet the op is not telling the entire story.

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RalphyNader
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I really hope the plea deal isn't a small fine or probation. So now she will have to defend what she was charged for. And a good defense usually isn't, \"she pushed me as I cut in line\". Especially since no witness accounts for the events like she describes.

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fitzhume
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Shouldn't the headline be \"15 Years In Prison After Fighting With Police\"?

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AK47 - Now with longer screen name!
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@fitzhume: Technically, yes, but would that make you want to read the article?

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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She had left the small minded town atmosphere and gone to college where she had become used to being treated fairly as an equal and when she returned she forgot how to act like she knew \" her place\" in Kennet, Missouri.


From their perspective she is standing up good posture, smiling, good clothes on not acting head bowed ,no eye contact. We just saw the movie \"Mississippi Burning\" the other night. Yeah we know what goes on in Kennet.


Furthermore, the problem is an economic issue. The Wal Marts in Boca Raton,FL or Sonoma, AZ or any other ritzy area of town don't usually have long checkout lines that cause customers fighting with one another.


Being a big Wal Mart shopper throughout the country, I find it strange that it is usually only the poorer communities where WalMart has a string of checkout counters at runing the entire front of the store, but with only one or two actually in service.

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RecordStoreToughGuy_starcommandseries.com
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@anneka: Ah, so seeing one movie makes you an expert in not only history, but race relations.

And I went to school for it like a chump!

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@RecordStoreToughGuy_IsBeing(pur)SuedByAMonster: checkout - pardon the pun -what vanilla 5 has to say , she lives there!

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@anneka: I'm not convinced that a fictional movie about Mississippi in 1964 is actually going to tell you about Missouri in 2009.

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malo-ji
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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\"She's apparently been offered plea deals but has refused them on principal ...\"


Principal who? Or do you mean 'principle'?

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valthun
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I see this whole thing all the time at grocery stores, and similar places. I don't have a problem with it. Its obvious they were all waiting in different lines to find the fastest one. The person in front will either leave, or the other person will join.

As long as they aren't trying to have two separate receipts I guess. Since the point is to just add to an existing list of items, its especially obvious when the person in front of you doesn't have anything to check out with. Its not like someone wouldn't just jump in line with their friend, like they just needed to go replace or get that one item, while the friend stands in that super long stupid line that occurs.

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henrygates
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Obviously other people's universes work better for them. I never cut lines, because no matter what line I'm in, it will always be the shortest. Even if the entire lane next to me empties and I'm still waiting, someone will race to the register before I can get my cart moved over, and that person will have at least one item without a UPC tag, and/or will start arguing with the price and demand to see a manager.

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morganlh85
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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If the people are paying TOGETHER, then they aren't really cutting, they are just adding additional items to their order. Now if the person is doing a totally different transaction, that's line cutting and it's not cool. But really the best solution is to be silently pissed off...there's no reason to cause a confrontation with potentially crazy people in a Walmart.

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Whatever happened to letting people in front of you just because you want to make someone happy and hopefully they will pass the goodwill on to someone else.
I especially like to do this around the holiday season when everyone seems to be in such a rush.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@anneka: There's a difference between letting someone in front of you and someone simply getting in front of you because they feel they shouldn't have to wait.

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@anneka: You, madam, are an angel, and I can assure you that you make many people's day. What's more, they're probably likelier to let up on somebody themselves in turn, so your good deed spreads outward.

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not from around here
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I say: sentence her to 3 years cashiering at the Walmart she caused the problem in.

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Aeroracere
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I didn't see anyone else beating the dead horse, so I'll do it: Don't go to Wal-Mart. I'll bet real life money that these incidences happen more often (per thousand customers, or whatever) than at any other retailer.

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happyandblue2
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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As Dale Carnegie points out in his book \"How to Win Friends and Influence People\" cutting in line is a great way to meet new friends. Especially in prison I guess..

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trujunglist
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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i never allow people to cut in line and immediately call them out for it. fuck you for thinking your time is more important than mine. this happened to me the other day at target with some obviously stupid kids. they said \"oh, we didn't know there was a line\" and i said \"oh, all these people here are just standing around for the fuck of it huh? what are you, a fucking moron?\" they left.

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mamalicious
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@trujunglist: When you have to resort to profanity and name-calling to get your very good point across, I'd say you make yourself look worse than the line cutters.

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@trujunglist: @Geblah187: why does WalMart have umpteen registers at the front of the store but only two or three open? Yet we continue to tolerate their lines. Our money is good enough to make them one of the top ten richest families according to the Forbes list - but our time is not important to them. I guess it is a simple matter of courtesy and respect.


Would this sort of thing happen if peoples nerves weren't already frazzled trying to make ends meet.
Maybe we'd have enough goodwill left for our fellow man
to let them ahead of us once in a while and not take it as a personal insult.

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Geblah187
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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It's not having to wait a few more minutes to pay for your items that is the issue ... it's the fact that the people who cut in your line are basically saying that their purchase/time/etc is more important than whatever you were doing, and they don't care if it's an inconvenience to you. It's a matter of simple courtesy and respect.

I always start out by saying something polite, but if I catch that note of defiance in their reply - I don't hesitate to let them know exactly how I feel, in a voice loud enough for everyone to hear.

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XTC46
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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anyone who cuts, without getting permissions, is rude, end of story. If you cut you are saying \"Im too good to wait the extra few minutes in line, but everyone behind me isnt\" and thats crap. If you are in a rush, and have 1 or 2 things, then ask if its ok. If you are in a rush and have a cartfull of things, plan better next time and deal with it.


It sounds like she cut, was asked to leave, then had a fit. Ive seen this happen with people in stores when they dont get their way, they throw tantrums. Ive also seen people push cops when they try to restrain them. They act like a cop is a normal person who you can just shove away when they grab you to restrain you, they arent, that is resisting arest.


If the cops were using racial slurs, they should be punished for sure, but if she resisted arrest, so should she.

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@xtc46 - thinksmarter on twitter: thinking that line cutting is someone saying they are better than you, it sounds like very low self esteem. How would a person even come up with that idea? Sometimes people are just oblivious, think other people don't mind because they wouldn't in the same situation, in a big hurry for some good reason - sick relative at home etc.
Wal Mart would never put people from the rich side of town in the situation of waiting in a long line. Maybe its Wal Mart who thinks you deserve to wait in a long line while umpteen registers remain closed.
I guess this sort of thing gives them free publicity.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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it sounds like very low self esteem

@anneka: That doesn't even make sense.

think other people don't mind because they wouldn't in the same situation

Those people are stupid. I'm serious. Assuming that everyone else would act and think the same way you would is just dumb.

in a big hurry for some good reason - sick relative at home

Then they should say so.

Some people cut in do cut in line because they feel like they're too good to wait. Go read some of the stories over in the customerssuck.com forums.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@anneka: Actually, you don't even have to go to customerssuck.com. There's a comment right here that shows what I'm talking about.

Id let my friend borrow money if asked, but wouldnt take theirs without asking, and if they took mine without asking it would be theft
.@xtc46 - thinksmarter on twitter: Excellent point.

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XTC46
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@anneka: If you are in a hurry, then ask, assuming no one will mind that you are forcing them to wait longer is stupid and rude. Thinking \"well I would do it if I were in x situation\" is not the appropriate way to guage something.


Id let my friends borrow my car if they asked in most cases, but I wouldnt go take theirs without asking.


Id let my friend borrow money if asked, but wouldnt take theirs without asking, and if they took mine without asking it would be theft.


Permissions to do something makes all the difference in the world.


I dont have problems waiting in line, I do have problems with people thinking they for some reason dont need to wait in the same line as everyone else.

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korybing
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Wow, there are a lot of very negative feelings from other posters about line-cutters. Honestly guys, at the end of the day is this really something to get into a fight about? So the guy cut in line, yes that's rude, yes it's obnoxious, but you'd really let it escalate into a fight if push came to shove?

Choose your battles. Your ulcers will thank you for it.

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@korybing@korybing: like you said pick your battles - what will this matter in a hundred years.
It is one thing to say - excuse me but you are line cutting and the line ends back there - but to start shoving and pushing or worse is very immature and shows little to no good judgement.

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korybing
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@anneka: Yeah there's nothing wrong with saying \"Excuse me I think you're cutting in line, the end is back there\", but if the guy is going to be a total jerk about it whatever, man. Let him be a jerk. I'm sure it makes him feel like a real big man. I'm not getting into a fight over my space in line.

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AK47 - Now with longer screen name!
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@korybing: Gotta disagree. I'll call out a line jumper because in my book, when you act like an asshat you need to be held accountable for being an asshat. Letting them go on their merry way seems like confirming that it's OK for them to be an asshat, and it's not.


However, I'm a very low-stress person and I have no trouble calling someone out in a situation like this without raising my blood pressure or inducing an ulcer. :)

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h3llc4t, breaker of office dress codes
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@korybing: I wouldn't get into a fight about it, it's not worth getting socked in the face over something so trivial, but oh would I burn holes in the back of their head with the Laser Eyes of Death.

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coan_net
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Oh... OK, the title is misleading again.

15 years in jail is probable resisting arrest & the kicking & fighting with offerciers.

If that happened, or needed to happen is the debate here - but she is NOT going to get 15 years in prison for cutting in line...

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TheKuudere
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I have a similar story that happened just yesterday. I work in customer service in retail and while we're not really meant to act like a register to ring people up (we're really there for returns), we can't turn away people who show up wanting to buy stuff.

Yesterday it was incredibly busy. I had lines all day, and all the other staff were too busy with their own tasks to help me out. But when it's just returns, I can take each person in under a minute, easily.

This woman comes by with piles of stuff to buy. She feigns that she has a question to ask me, then decides that's justification enough to purchase her many things with me. There are about 8 people lined up behind her at this point. She keeps checking behind her, and I think this is because she feels guilty making others wait to do returns. That is not the case. She's actually looking everywhere for her friend so her friend can cut behind her. At one point, she leaves the line while I'm still ringing, and shouts to her friend at the other side of the store to hurry up. The people behind are rolling their eyes, but there's nothing I can do without insulting this lady.

So then she calls her friend twice on her cellphone to tell her to get back to customer service so she can ring up her stuff with her. Finally, the friend comes up with a whole other basket filled. I'm just shocked. She has no regard for the people behind her at all. After over twenty minutes with her, I help the person behind her, who I discover is actually the pregnant girlfriend of a friend of mine. Yes, the woman didn't care that she made a very pregnant woman stand and wait the whole time.

The woman behind the pregnant woman was so appalled by everything, that I offered her a comment card to share her feelings with my manager. Which I made sure was left on my manager's desk. Hopefully, incidents like this will eventually give me the authority to turn rude people like this away so they can go to the proper lines for checkout. Sheesh.

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oldgraygeek
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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One of the best (or worst) things about having a concealed carry permit is that you don't start sh*t with anyone, for any reason.
Five years ago, my unarmed & younger self would have objected loudly. Today, I would probably just STFU unless I was at risk of financial loss or injury.

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guspaz
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Sigh, if the police are trying to arrest you, rightfully or wrongfully, DON'T RESIST. You'll only make things worse for yourself.

If you're being wrongfully arrested, you may be able to explain yourself later. If you resist arrest because you feel like you're being wrongfully arrested, you might get hit with the very real charges of resisting arrest and assaulting a police officer. Even if the original charge is dropped, your actions during the arrest might stick!

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bigd7387
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Unless she has video evidence of the Police using racial slurs then I would imagine it's another case of their race as an excuse. This is the type of event that makes actual people who suffer from racism go unreported and abused. If she/they have proof then it's uncalled for but if they don't then they should be procecuted. I see people of every race everyday acting as if they are the only ones that matter. What ever happened to manners?

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@bigd7387: You sound so self righteous, never made a mistake, never lost your temper, always do what's just right.
Did you ever \"imagine\" what it would be like to be treated badly just because of chance - you don't pick your parents or your color of skin. Wake up

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technoluster
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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This story happened in my fiancée's hometown. One of her friends from high school is a witness in this trial. I asked my fiancée about it and she said it is a big mess and no one seems to know the truth about what really happened.
I saw a news report on this from the local CBS affiliate and they made it sound like the place is a hot bed of racial tension. This is just not right. It's a shame how an incident like this can give a location a bad name. I don't know what really happen, but I hope whoever is in the wrong, the police or the lady, gets justice served on them.

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outlulz
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I don't mind two people waiting in two separate lines because I do it all the time. But there should only be one set of items between the two. If both people have items to checkout and one leaves another line to join their companion I may have a problem with it. But honestly, I'm almost never in a hurry when I shop and if the person asks if someone can join them I usually say yes. I don't really care.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@outlulz: If you're almost never in a hurry then why do you cut in line all of the time? That makes no sense.

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@outlulz: Glad to hear there are still reasonable people out there. I agree with you.

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XTC46
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@anneka: \"and if the person asks if someone can join them I usually say yes\"


Ok, what if you are in a hurry, and they dont ask, and have a lot of stuff. Does it bother you?


If they ask, you are right, its typically not a big deal, but it is just rude to not ask, and if the article is right and she just started pushing other peoples stuff back on the belt so hers would fit, its even more of a problem.

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GMFish
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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God, learn how to write a headline. She is not facing 15 years in prison for cutting in line, but for starting a confrontation, possibly assault, and for resisting arrest. Those types of things are against the law, even in Walmart.

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msbask
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Pretty sure this has been pointed out at least three times.

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vladthepaler
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Ejecting her from the store is a reasonable response to cutting in line.

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Jabberkaty
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Not a fan of line cutters. If someone asks nice I'd be inclined to let them in. Mostly because they aren't just acting self-important.

I just don't like the assumption that you can cut because you feel like you're in a bigger rush than me, or that I don't deserve even the smallest consideration such as asking first.

Asking really does go a long way in my book.

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nodaybuttoday
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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If the people are paying together, then I think it's okay to cut. I kind of have to wonder if the woman is just playing the \"race card\". I once had a woman in walmart yell at me because I picked up my purse when I left my cart, saying I picked it up because \"she was black\". WTF? I don't care what color you are, I don't trust ANYONE enough to leave my purse in my cart. She ended up following me around and yelling at me for two aisles. Crazy people at walmart...

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MooseOfReason
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Misleading headline.

If she went to prison, it would be for assault.

Also, the trial hasn't happened yet. 15 years is the maximum, which she is unlikely to get, in my opinion.

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masterasia
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I hate ghetto people.

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SwimDude
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I find that far too many people poke their nose in other people's business. I was in Costco yesterday; I spent about $200 and made the mistake of putting my bottled water purchase onto the conveyer belt instead of leaving it in my cart. The checker 25 year old male, said I could leave it in my cart, but frankly I already had it on the belt and didn't want to move it again. The Checker said to me I could leave the water in my cart 3 different times. I finally said in an annoyed tone, that I heard him the first time.


The Checker then started to explain that he was just trying to be nice to me. Nice? I already had the water on the belt; please just finish checking out the people in front of me so you can start checking me out.


This exchange between me and the checker prompted a man in the lane next to me, to made a comment to his wife that I was an \"A**Hole\". Nice, my 13 year old daughter heard what he said. Just to be certain I heard Correctly, I leaned in to the man and asked, \"Did you just call me an \"A**Hole?\" the man responded yes.


Yes, I followed the man and his wife to their car, and proceeded to tell him that People like him are the reason America is in trouble. Many of you feel the need to stick your nose in or comment on things that are not your business. Basically, Folks, Shut the F*&^ Up! Mind your own business... The life you save may be your own...

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floraposte
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@SwimDude: You followed the guy to his car and harassed him, but you think he's the source of American ills?

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the_wiggle
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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@floraposte: and followed with your kid yet?

not cool dude. not cool.

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Wal Mart has us all standing in line waiting to give them our hard earned money. Our money is good enough to make them top the list of ten of the richest families according to those yearly lists published by Forbes and Fortune. BUT- well our time isn't that important to them - that is why they have rows of unopened checkout counters at the front of the store as we stand waiting forever, and gnashing our teeth at out fellow consumers. Is it right that we give Wal Mart our money & they send it to China where the Chinese steal our patents making reengineered junk copies of our stuff. When the local competitor is run out of business, what choice do we have but to work for an employe who pays their employees minimum wage, gives them minimal training & understaff the registers 'cuz it's more cost effective while they sit in Bentonville counting our hundred dollar bills?
But wait, we blame it on the poor guy in front of us - yeah, that's right, he's the one disrespecting us.
Thmink!

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mariospants
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I've almost gotten into fights over line budding in the past, and this sounds most egregious (sp?). If you miss the window of opportunity (i.e. you have to shove the succeeding customer's shit back) then you've come too late.

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Jesse in Japan
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I find it very hard to believe that as recently as three years ago, Wal-Mart did not have security cameras pointed at the registers. Where is the footage?

It is not cool to cut in line and it makes no difference to the people behind you whether the person you're joining is your cousin, though.

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Vanilla5
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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My family is from Southeast Missouri - a town very, very close to Kennett (where this happened). The police are bored and do, indeed, use that kind of language.

Should she have jumped line? No. Am I surprised that she was treated this way? Absolutely not, unfortunately.

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rellog321
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I say the store was well within their rights to deny her service. She skipped someone and was asked to leave. End of story.
I had an incident where an older man raced past us to cut in front of us as we neared the checkout line. It was all my friend could do to talk me out of confronting the guy. I hate rude people and have no problem making a scene....

If people were less apt to allow this behavior, maybe it wouldn't be so pervasive....

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sevenwhitehorses
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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really? it is that important to some of you not to let a friend join another in a line?

i think if you split up to get the fastest line it is fine to join your friend. but not to have a cart full of stuff where others have to all back up carts and such.

HOWEVER, if they are already where people have their items on the belt behind your friends stuff, well you are just out of luck, you waited too long. pushing someones items back is just not cool at all.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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i think if you split up to get the fastest line it is fine to join your friend.

@sevenwhitehorses: No, it is not. It's cutting. If you want to check out together then get in the same line.

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jenjen
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I don't particularly mind the two people getting in separate lines to see which one comes up first, as others have said, when they are really shopping together. What pisses me off is where one person gets in line to the spot and the other person shops and brings stuff back to the cart. You don't get in line until you are finished shopping.

I really appreciate stores that use the one queue approach where there's no guessing as to which cash will go quicker. Everyone gets their turn, and it's all fair.

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edrebber
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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The police claim they arrested her because \"she refused to calm down and leave the property\". But then the story goes on to say that \"Officers eventually followed her to the parking lot\". It seems like she was leaving the property.

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BytheSea
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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If the line cutter is carrying on in a way that's going to get her arrested? Let her fucking get in front of you.

Otherwise, \"Excuse me, this is a line\" or \"the end of the line is back there\" in a snotty tone usually reminds people we are not in kindergarten anymore.

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JollyJumjuck
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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This clip from an episode of \"Dead Like Me\" deals with this sort of situation very nicely. The writing in that show was simply incredible.

[www.metacafe.com]

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skitchparks
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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is it 15 years for cutting in line? or because she supposedly resisted arrest and hit a couple of cops? I think the consumerist needs to stop making wild headlines that hardly reflect what is actually in the article.

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Moosenogger
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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I don't mind people joining their relative in front of me (I've done this with my mom, actually), as long as the new person doesn't have 500 items to purchase. If it's something small and will only take an extra few minutes, I'm fine with it.

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nstonep
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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If it's split pay (separate transactions) you wait in the back of the line. If it's combined pay (one transaction) 10 items or less.

Otherwise, you should get punched in the face and dragged out of the store...not necessarily by the police.

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Brat2b4u
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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As someone from Canada, generally we are polite and keep quiet on most issues.

Most of us would not be confrontational in a silly situation like this.

I must admit, though, I love U.S.-style justice.

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jrs
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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So, I am an American living in Singapore - which often gets a rap for its tough legal system.

But really - a possible 15 years for cutting in line?? Okay, the resisting arrest/disorderly charges might hold water. You have to wonder if a little calm professionalism by WalMart and the officers might have de-escalated the situation? Maybe take the woman aside, let her pay for her items and ask her to please show more consideration in the future?

Maybe I am a sentimental fool, but the America I remember had a lot more common sense and calmness than we seem to exhibit at times today.

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@jrs: I agree with your middle paragraph. A little de=escalation and calm professionalism would have gone a long way to prevent this situation from getting out of hand. Glad to know there are still people with common sense out there.

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zibby
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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\"Lady, I'm afraid I'm going to have to ask you to leave the store.\"


\"I'll swallow your soul!\"

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TCinIowa
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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She's not facing prison time for line jumping.


She's facing prison time for resisting arrest and assulting a police officer.


My guess is that racism is involved, starting with the chaos at the line. I bet in southern Missouri a redneck with a stars-and-bars t-shirt and camoflage pants switches lines to be with his cousin (err, wife) the rest of the rednecks in line don't make noise, but when a black woman cuts in line the SOUTH WILL RISE AGAIN RIGHT NOW. From there it only escalated and the legendary fairness and color blindness of southern law enforcement took it from there.


Sorry to be stereotypical, but the fact is stereotypes come from somewhere and the stupidest of our fellow citizens are especially on edge lately.


If you have any doubts, go to peopleofwalmart.com and look at the pictures from the bible belt Walmarts.


Hopefully the national attention this case is getting will override the local anger and everyone can apologize for overreacting. It's not likely to happen since the cops won't back down for fear of being sued and the woman shouldn't back down because someone needs to stand up to bullying cops.


I suppose the moral of the story is don't cut in line.

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anneka
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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@TCinIowa: I think you have a pretty good take on the whole thing.

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Covertghost
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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The only time you can cut in line, is if you both plan on paying for the items together.


Otherwise? March your happy ass to the back of that line.

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Rectilinear Propagation
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Cutting in line is always rude, no exceptions. I don't care what your relationship is with the person standing in front of me. Relative, friend, or stranger you just made my wait longer.

If you got in line together and one of you left the line because you forgot an item that's OK with me (because it's better than waiting until the cashier asks if you found everything and then hold up the line to get the forgotten item) but you still need to get back before the other person finishes checking out.

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ModernTenshi04
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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For me, if the lanes have been packed, I'm not very tolerant of line cutters, as I've likely been waiting 20 minutes already. Should they not be too busy, and the person only has a couple of items (read: 50% less than me), I'll likely just let them go.

Also: cute girls can cut in front of me.

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SoCalGNX
November 18, 2009 4:52 PM
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Other reports I have read about this state she shoved someone elses items out of the way to line jump. She was rude and wrong to line jump. Its not ok to do this - go to the end of the line. Too bad she chose to play the race card. 15 years would be idiotic but 90 days community service might be good.

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Xeos
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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This story is not about line cutting, why deliberately exclude the major subject of the story?

Anyway, line cutting is bad, but not kicked-out-of-the-store bad.

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cranke
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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I hate it when people cut in line. Results were extreme, probably illegal, but bitch won't cut in line anymore. Too bad her civil liberties were violated, too bad she lacks etiquette.

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squidbait
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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To be fair, \"Go on back home\" DOES sound a lot like \"Go back to the ghetto\".

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gengeo
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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The race card was entered by the media. At that point the players lined up to take advantage of the national spotlight.

read here : [geogee.wordpress.com]

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AngrySmoker1
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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What they left out of this is the fact that the young lady apparently shoved back the person behind her cousins stuff to make room for her stuff, which is quite rude. Then she got an attitude like she was entitled to do whatever she wants since her cousin was in line. I would not mind if she added a few things but you can't just move people things that were in the line before you jumped in and then get an attitude with them when they complain.

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omphalos204
November 18, 2009 4:53 PM
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Missouri, clearly, is still a place with the KKK POLICES the citizenry. This is a disgusting example, of a small issue getting TOTALLY blown out of proportion, by an overzealous, racist, police department. And as far as \"taking a plea\" good for her that she instead chooses to bring the fact that police officers VIOLATED HER CIVIL RIGHTS AND USED RACIAL SLURS. Lets see those officers get handed their pink slips, before they create the sort of environment, faced by civil rights workers, decades ago.
We don't need to go backwards, we need to go forward, and there is NO PLACE for racism in police departments, where they are to uphold the LAW OF THE LAND, not the LAW OF THE CLAN.

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kent909
November 23, 2009 5:31 PM
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Another reason to not patronize WM. As if we needed one.

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O-Dog
November 28, 2009 8:41 AM
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similar incident at the CNE here... My Mom is lined up for a ride and is cut by a rather large intimidating African-Canadian woman with her son. I was not there at the initial confrontation on but arrived shortly after the woman called my Mom a British bitch and pushed her. All the other customers took steps back and I feared for my Mom much older and weaker. I stepped in between and advised her she was under arrest for assault. One thing led to another with a lot of foul language from this woman in front of all the kiddies. I wanted to deck her right in the mouth! Being a former police officer I waited knowing my wife had already fetched the police. She fought with police yelling racial slurs and calling the race card herself. She was charged with Assault x 2, Assault Police, and Causing a Disturbance. She was found guilty but being Canada she got off lightly eh? 3 years probation and anger management. I seriously doubt police officers would say that. What could they possibly gain? When the oppressed become the oppressors? Take care in what you say, it could be more damning that your actions.

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