Hey - I don't think the fry-jockeys at McDonald's are kidnappers. Let's be clear we're talking about TSA types here.

@bebette: Yeah, the way she described her "emergency Xanax" stashed in her pocket seemed weird & drama-queeney to me - and rightly so, now that we know the truth. I take Xanax with me when I travel, too, but I carry it in my purse, in its original Rx bottle that has my name on it. Why the big deal about hiding it, then sneaking off to take it, unless you don't have a valid Rx from your Dr.

This is an airline. It is not the government, it's not the police.

TSA is not the government, eh?

Like we really need more m4ss1v3 1nt3rn37 p3n05 posturing here :(

OK she goes on the no fly list for making crap up.

The TSA has added a bunch of new videos from different angles for the remaining "they doctored the tape" people. Same page, just scroll down past the original post.

I think Blogger Bob gets my nomination for Blogger of the Year.

That being said, I find your misogynistic comments about childbirth to be just as distasteful as the woman in this story. As for coherency in replies, the only thing inadequate around here is your reading comprehension skills and your respect for 51% of the population.

@kathyl:

Nicole White has updated her blog, and confirmed that she IS the woman in the video.

Unless, of course, someone has hijacked her blog and, posing as her, has posted a quasi-apology.

@Frank From Virginia:

The timestamps on the video are what really make Nic's version of events…problematic.

She claims the video was edited. Missing time: 20 seconds between the overhead view of the x-ray conveyor and the view of the holding box (11:01:40, 11:02:00), then 19 seconds between that view and the view of the search table area (11:04:12, 11:04:31).

The only other missing part is about 5 minutes of standing in line at the beginning.

Editing video is one thing, but it's _extremely_ difficult to fake timestamps, even if you know what you're doing.

Beyond the timestamps are all of the other things happening in the video - during key parts of her story, there is no sign of editing (people moving through don't suddenly appear or disappear).

Could that be edited together with people & actions that weren't necessarily going on? Sure. But that's a very time-consuming process, requiring a certain level of expertise. Assuming that TSA _did _contract with people from Industrial Light and Magic to edit this video, they still would not have released the video when they did-that sort of editing takes days at the least.

I understand that some people are still sympathetic to Nic and want to give her the benefit of the doubt. But at this point, what Nic's basically saying is 'THE TSA TOOK MY BABY AND THERE'S A SOPHISTICATED GOVERNMENT CONSPIRACY TO COVER IT UP."

And that, I think, is why the responses to Nic's apology in the now-deleted Comments section of her site are so hostile. She not only made a non-apology, playing the 'Rashamon' card, but she's in essence insulted the intelligence of everyone who watched the video.

The part that stood out to me was that as the kid was being carried off by the TSA worker, he looked at the man "awkwardly" and said "no no no no." Wouldn't most kids be screaming their heads off if they were being carried away from a parent by a stranger? That alone would probably make the TSA worker in this fictional situation bring the kid right back to his mother.

'Docile and obediant' used to be the startegy for surviving a hijaciking, but that paradigm changed before the fourth plane went down... Which is why the current 'security theatre' that is the TSA is meaningless, feel-good hype. Never again will passengers sit meekly and hope to be rescued.

So why should flyers meekly take it up the ass by by TSA thugs?

this is rhetorical because I know that TSA released a cc vidoe of the incedent showing a very different scenario than the Nicole's account. (if that even was the same woman- I'd really like the woman to confirm that that was indeed her on the vidoe we saw).

What is it with the media-whoring parents this week? First the CO balloon incident, now this. I note that this woman's blog is driven by advertisements. I wonder how much money her lies about this incident have netted her.

Consumerist can't take the story down - it's official public record in a way - and it's entertaining to read all of the vitriol it generated, but perhaps we need a little disclaimer before the comments to remind people that "it's all speculation until proven otherwise".

Oh, ironic juxtapositions, I love you.

I do hope that TSA takes more action - a libel suit maybe? Turn that lucrative lie into a lesson about trying to profit by harming a company's reputation. Not that I'm a fan of TSA by any means, by the way.

On another note, I wonder why the post is still visible on her blog. She apparently logged in to black out her prior posts and disable comments, so she's around. An explanation, apology, denial, or even just taking the post off for now would seem to be in order.

Having watched this unfold over the past two days, I find it interesting (!!!) how easily she tapped into everybody's rage cortex. Her post was so full of ridiculous, unnecessary dramatic pauses and bold-font-ed exaggeration that I'm surprised so many people took it at face value. Maybe it was just the type of story that was easy to believe, or just a good excuse for alot of people to have some much-needed self-righteous, rage-y moments.

Oh well. Live and learn. Trust nothing on the 'tubes that isn't a cat playing some sort of instrument or flushing a toilet.

"TSA has posted their CCTV video of the incident. In the video, the child is never picked up by TSA agents or removed from the mother's sight."

UM, if it has been proved this woman is lying and the child was never taken from her why is this story still here where those who don't read the update think TSA snatches children.

Has this woman been arrested for making false claims?

Oh, pshaw. It could very well be a cover up video filmed in a sound stage in California, just like the moon landing.

You really don't need to piss your "wooo I hate breeders and their crotchfruit" issues over every discussion, you know.

I think LadySiren was just responding to your comment about special rights for people who squeeze babies out of vaginas. It was a tad bit harsh. Though I agree that parents shouldn't expect special rights the rest of us don't get, certain descriptors can be hot-button.

But all's well that ends well, I suppose. In the end, I hope this starts a trend of the TSA releasing CCTV video of events even when the video doesn't paint its agents in a favorable light. Transparency is important.

The child was never taken away. This really looks like a mommyblogger trying to get a bunch of hits by cashing in on a normal experience. Everyone hates the TSA, you have a "typical" experience and suddenly its this awful body cavity search, baby stealing ordeal.

She was in the box for a couple minutes, read as under 5. She was agitated and as someone who carries "emergency xanax" it began to balloon in her head. Be nice to know if she has a prescription or just uses an online pharmacy to manage her "problems".

I wonder if she is the same mom who called 911 because the fast food place wouldn't make the burger how she wanted. From the outside this is obviously a stupid thing, but in her persecuted mind it was the next logical step.

As someone who obviously can not separate reality from hallucination I think the local authorities need to check up on her child. Her version vs the video footage shows a huge disconnect from reality, and these are often the people on the news after something horrible happens and they neighbors say "She was always so sweet and nice." as the body bag is loaded into the coroners van.

I enjoyed the people who posted on the TSA blog, stating obviously she was making it up but still trying to find the TSA at fault for some reason. While the TSA might not be everyones favorite thing, can we at least allow ourselves to admit that in this case they did nothing wrong? TSA might be evil, stupid, pointless, etc... but in this single case they did their job and managed to set off a woman who has "issues".

Cheers? OMG we almost died all was lost worst day of my life. Cheers!

let the defamation suits begin!

@ThyGuy: Better be careful man, we are dealing with Internet Tough Guys here.

@LadySiren: You have demonstrated your lack of intelligence with that statement. Hate coming up with reasonable responses much? Do you feel so inadequate in your own ability to respond to a coherent thought that you have to resort to some douche style comment.

"Hate women much? DURR DURR DURR"

By the way, if you read the update you will see that the child was never seperated from it's mother.

I watched the video.

I read the blog.

I re-watched the video.

Yup, not gonna get that tune out of my head all day. No sirree.

Three things to this woman:
1. The fact (and I use that term lightly in reference to you) you were running late does not mean the TSA should move faster or accomodate you differently.
2. Yeah, you were held in a plastic box for two minutes. Boo frickin' hoo.
3. Now your site is black with a simple note "Too much traffic has taken this site down." (I tried to view another page to see if you had comments allowed anywhere on your blog.) Your planning skills really do suck.

I seriously doubt the TSA is in a huge conspiracy to make this woman look like a head case.

What did she think the cameras where for? show?

@jacques: yea it says "due to high traffic"

Which is either BS or her way of avoiding.

She's gonna get serious backlash. I would imagine she thought they would just roll over and she'd be on Oprah or some crap fantasy like that.

I hope she gets what's coming to her.

You notice the blog's completely down save this story right now? Everything sends to a black page. Makes looking for pictures to match up pretty difficult. Also, she took down all the comments.

Maybe she'll send her kid up in a weather balloon for her next trick.

I love that everybody automatically believes all the ills of corporations and ignores that people can lie.

3 reasons.

1.) She wrote this on a blog where she makes money from traffic.

2.) Local news organizations love this sorta thing

3.) She knows of the anti love of airports/TSA's/and airlines.

Next time you need to put the word "Alleged" like the real news articles do so you don't end up with egg on your face in the same way.

I know we will all forget this happened in a week, and this woman's blog will either garner more strength from this or die all together.

...thinks about a blog to make and then lie about crap.....

I fly every few months through large and small airports, and have found that in 95% of the times I've had any interactions with the TSA outside of the standard pass through and collect your stuff, if you treat them like people, you'll get treated like a person as well. Once you start swearing and yelling, their reptilian brains get set off and you'll find yourself delayed and subject to extra screenings. Yeah, you'll get the dicks (I'm looking at you, JFK security lady who made me go through extra screening because I was running), but not often.

I hope this mother made her good money on adsense spreading her fake story, just like the fake mother blog from a few months ago from the crazy lady in Chicago. I also hope that said revenue stream dries up.

How do we know this is the woman? How did you know it was her? Over 2 million passengers go through US airports every day.

Thanks for reading the blog and for your comment.

As soon as we saw the blog post, we reached out to the Atlanta airport. TSA at the Atlanta airport contacted Nic, but she didn't respond.

The blog post gave some key details: the airport, the gate (which can pinpoint the checkpoint)and an approximate time. The post also notes things that happened - the passenger calling out to people and officers from the holding area, and a female passenger getting Nic's bags for her. All of these details were helpful.

The blog has numerous pictures of the woman, the baby and the stroller. They match the video.

We take claims like this seriously, and the TSA staff at ATL used the information to pull the CCTV tape within a window of time that matched details in the blog post.

Nic was contacted more than once by TSA yesterday, but as of last night, had not responded.

"Crazy Psycho Woman on Xanax Makes Up Bullshit TSA Story"

And before y'all accuse me of being insensitive to parents, I happen to have five of the little buggers. I would never dream of pimping out my kids so I could get a few more hits on my substandard blog.

[www.tsa.gov]

There is video proof

I'd like to see what my underwire bras do to the scanner. or would they like me to strip and reveal my way too big udders to the world instead? If I have to travel anywhere, I'm going by car.

[www.tsa.gov]

@VaMPKiSS1:

I don't see it as a matter of common decency, although it may be a little odd. The uproar is far more surprising to me.

frodolives35: Fuck you too douche bag.

Christ you're cold hearted.

No, no one deserves to have their child taken from them for any amount of time no matter how rude they're being.

If they're being rude, threaten arrest and detain them under those circumstances, but there's no reason that she shouldn't have been able to supervise the child's search with the TSA officer, even if it needed to be done after her own search. By the simple fact that they needed to be searched separately, they clear the mom and then search the baby under her supervision. What if they had found something she had been unable to explain while out of her sight? How defensible is it for that TSA officer to have planted something on the baby and bring that back? It's a pretty exaggerated whatif scenario, but go re-read the post again.

It's pretty messed up without sticking any whatif's in there at all. Even if she cursed, she didn't deserve that. Even if she's screamed bloody murder the whole time. There's protocol and then there's poor training and execution of a situation. Crap like this is the same kind of abuse of power that sees every handicapped person in a wheelchair pass through TSA screening like they're the next Al Qaeda operative. What happened to all this million dollars of screening equipment in every airport? Why isn't it being used to help out the less fortunate and overburdened get screened in a slightly less obtrusive way?

@lmarconi: AMEN I have not flown in 7 years because I know I would not put up with alot of crap from the new security forces. I don't need to go to jail at my age and even if you can fight "City Hall" the cost is not worth it.

@emis: That is not true. You will just get mauled as you lay there. You have a greater chance by yelling and flailing your arms and most bears will run away. However I don't think that would work with the TSA agents.

@[DFX] Deimos: Idiot

And I'm saying this without even having children of my own. It's not a matter of special rights. It's a matter of common sense and human decency. Which seem to be sorely lacking nowadays.

Obviously.

A lot of people are saying "Oh well you'd end up in the Gulag," but when you're in that situation adrenaline tends to overrule conspiracy-theory ideas. A good lawyer and media exposure can go a long way to rectify many cover-ups.

This is so fucking sick. They had an interview on CNN, I think, the other day with some TSA agents and how hard it is to "take abuse" and how they are always nice and courteous to passengers and have a bad rap, etc... but I travel a lot for my job and for every nice TSA agent (and yes, there are some!) it seems like there are 10 others who sit there and bark at passengers, are unnecessarily rude, and who love their little power trips. I'm sorry I can't take my shoes and my belt off, get my laptop out of my bag, and pull out my eensy weensy bag of tiny liquids in less than 30 seconds. I'm working on it!

Besides the fact that they took this poor woman's child out of her line of vision, they kept saying "I don't care about your flight" and "you need to calm down"... how do either of these responses provoke anything but more agitation? What morons. I hope she files a complaint, but I'm sure it will just get stored in the round file.

Nailed it.

That is what happened. You put every person around at high alert and don't violate any laws (that I know of).

First off, I believe the TSA was very much in the wrong if they took the kid and didnt tell the mom where they were taking him. Id even believe that they tried to tell her and she just didnt understand becasue of her condition, which would still be unacceptable on TSAs part. No question about it. If you need to search a kid, you have the parent come with you and you go to a private area. End of story.

That being said, I want to know how somone with this kind of condition is considered competent to be a parent, and trusted to travel alone with their child. Seriously. She began freaking out when people were asking her questions becasue she thought she was going to be late. Then somone took her kid and she broke down in a panic, and was about to passout. Going after the guy violently would have been an over reaction, but understandable considering the situation, but completely breaking down is not, she was unable to protect her child or even rationally understand the situation. That is irresponsible parenting. The world is not perfect, and there are stressers all over. What if somone yelled at her while driving on a freeway, would she freakout and crash? what if a car was just getting too close, or red lights were taking too long.

I dont blame the victim in this situation becasue Im sure she wants to be a good parent, but she does need to understand her limits, and her family (her husband especially) should not allow this type of thing to happen.

I also blame TSA for not recognizing an obviously mentally unstable person and then allowing them to board a plane in that condition while trying to care for a child.

They sent me through the detector again, it went off, I volunteered it was probably my underwire. "No, it can't be, that doesn't set them off." Patted me down, asked me to be wanded. What do you know, the wand goes off over my breasts. I volunteered to take it off and be re-wanded (I can do that without removing my t-shirt fyi), nope, have to be taken to a sideroom to be fully searched. Gah.

@Applekid: Really?

None? Huh. I find that suprising.

That said, no TSA would have been ALLOWED to touch my baby. I would have tackled that agent if they had attempt to take my kid.

You know who has a right to flip the fk out over having babies taken away...

Parents.

Searching her child, fine. Taking her child away, alone, out of sight? No freaking way.

In related news, I really REALLY hope the new Consumerist comments system allows us to ignore and/or rank other commenters. I really do.

@Kyin: I love how people talk tough about what they would do to the TSA. The reality is that if you actually did "react violently" you would be put down immediately and with extreme prejudice, and rightfully so.

You would then probably be detained for a while and then charged with resisting a lawful order (or something of the sort).

Either way. You lose.

Honestly, I think you're going way overboard here. Her emo-ness was in no way the source of the TSA's action, and I find blaming her, as your posts seem to be doing, a inexplicable and unkind stretch.

@everyone in the other thread asking why she didn't just follow the guy:
She had four TSA agents standing around her, two of which were actually involved in inspecting her, and she was told "Ma'am, we're trying to be nice to you. We don't know which one of you went off in the metal detector. Stay here so I can search you." Yeah, she'd have made it about 3 steps.

I see "blame the victim" now has to preemptively justify itself.

Also, I don't think she could have handled it any better than she did. Different people will react to different situations differently. I would react violently, whereas she obviously just went into shock.

I guess where I was going with my original though of notification is that, say you have a toddler. And you don't go catatonic, perhaps, but you're hyperventilating, or worse, passing out. In public. You know this is coming. If you can let someone know (not in this case, but in the future) that this is about to happen your toddler may be better taken care of, instead of simply wandering off, into the street or into the hands of some random person, which is exactly what set her off in this post. Now, maybe she doesn't have attacks often, but if she stresses she always carries a Xanax, I would guess she does...

That's more what I was thinking. Let someone know what is happening if you're about to not be able to take care of your child for a short period of time. NOT blame - just management. If I had a kid, this is the sort of thing I'd be thinking.

But again, you're right - she didn't post here and maybe she's not looking for that sort of management.

I also think that we've got a real clash of discourse styles behind the responses and the original account, and that that's not getting credited. She's in the sharing-feelings school of mommyblogging that values depth of emotion; this is a forum about crusading and activism and empowerment that values clarity of argument and reacts to emotional appeal with suspicion. But she didn't post her story here, she posted it on her blog, where she wrote it the way it belongs there. I think if the story were written Consumerist-style with emphasis on the things that matter here, not on her blog, the reactions would have been very different, and that we might well be misreading the emphasis on her anxiety as a statement of her incapacitation when on her blog it's actually just a statement of its significance.

I'm no fan of the TSA or the supposed security theater they undertake, the new uniforms that make them look like cops is the frosting on the cake. Furthermore, this particular TSA goon is clearly worst than the rest. And finally, most people have turned into sheep you do what you are told without question or thought in response to the Wal-mart receipt checker or the TSA goon. No we don't need to knock down the 80 year old Wal-mart employee or the GED TSA agent, most of these folks respond well to a smile and a no thank you.

Receipt checker to SadSam - hey there need to check your receipt, SadSam - no thank you keep walking. In this situation, TSA goon - we need take your baby for further screening, no - thank you how about I go back through the metal detector.

Why would you even hand your child to a complete stranger? That part got me right there.

I read this whole thread, and while I agree that doing something > tantrum, you are pretty conveniently avoiding the fact that she has an anxiety disorder, and toeing the line of "douche" by continuing to do so while using more and more childish language to describe her freaking out and crying.

People with anxiety disorders freak out and cry when (more emotionally) normal people wouldn't.

So yeah... ideally, she should have done something. But in no way was this situation ideal, on either end.

Give the lady a break. Say "you shouldn't use the reaction of a person with an anxiety disorder to judge how bad the situation was on the surface, but at the same time TSA did break the rules pretty badly." In fact, that's what I'll go with.

If the TSA agent says "I need to hold the baby myself to look at him, if you're going to be allowed to get on the plane," would you really turn around and go home before you'd allow that? Because that's what your choice actually is.

I wasn't saying she was in the wrong - it wasn't a blame the OP post. Mostly what I was getting at was more of a for the future post. Anxiety attacks can leave you completely paralyzed. TSA could have flipped out on her. And if she's carrying a Xanax in her pocket, it's not like she's going to look like she's diagnosed, so she'll have a harder time sorting it out than if she could just whip out an Rx bottle and try to explain, perhaps with the help of a passerby if TSA doesn't know what Xanax does.

If she has panic attacks, the chances are, she's going to have one in public again. It doesn't matter what you, me, or anyone thinks about how she handled this. What matters is that she can take care of herself and her child. If she has a medalert bracelet or some way of notifying someone that there is something very wrong with her, she's likely to fare better than if she just collapses on the street motionless in the midst of an attack. She knew this attack was coming. She had the sense to call her husband and mom. If she had a card (like the Crohn's card we talked about on this site that peopled seemed to be all for) or a bracelet, it seems like it would only be for her benefit. I know if I had a kid, and had the potential of being catatonic, I'd like to have some way of notifying someone if I knew it was happening. In fact, I'd love to find a good migraine notification card instead of the cheesy-ass little cards I've made myself for when *I* go catatonic.

2) Law - Police can't take your kid without social services present unless there is imminent harm. Even then they have strict laws they need to abide by. The medical community needs a parent or guardian present or consent for most procedures.

What right of law gives TSA any rights to remove children from parents for any length of time? Several people have pointed out that the TSA makes it's own guideline that it won't take children away from parents, which implies some degree of authority that it *could* do so. Can anyone site what exactly their legal obligations are with respect to children and how they are to be handled?

I get the notion that probably most people would have supported her in being upset in the face of the TSA's breaching policy and removing her kid from her, but I don't think it's a Milgramite situation. They didn't do it to her and they almost certainly didn't get that that was what was happening.

I'm just depressed at how similar many of these posts are to the "stupid cop should have known to throw the car into neutral" responses to the floor-mat accident. The TSA didn't walk away with her baby because she has an anxiety disorder or symptoms thereof. The bad thing that they did was irrespective of her condition or personality.

Vote with your money, don't fly until this nonsense changes.

Those who trade a little security for freedom deserve neither.

Oh give me a break. The TSA did the right thing. Who cares if they separated a mother from her child? They said they were screening him, they took him and screened him, end of story.

Does she think that just because she performed the mind boggling stunt of squeezing a child out of her vagina that she gets some special rights?

It's likely that the TSA had no clue he was doing something wrong. Having seen the TSA's they look like high school drop outs and have way too much crap to memorize.

I'm with you. How is it, when I fly, I am basically treated as a prisoner in maximum security prison? "Shoes off people, move forward..faster people, faster. Place items here...QUICKLY. Move to the left, move out of the way. We hold the power, do not question us." Fuck them.

Way to assume every adult who handles your child is some sexual deviant.

Yes, the security should not have removed the child from his mother. The mother needs to take a chill pill herself. She can't help her kid is she is on the verge of blacking out at every little thing.

@chrialg6 is a happy effing cupcake: Actually I work in a hospital that treats kids who are the victims of sexual abuse. Every single one, without exception, was molested by someone in the immediate family. First in line is Dad, Stepdad, or Mom's Boyfriend. Second in line are brothers/stepbrothers.

"You need to adjust your attitude and do as you are told."

Fuck.that.

@ShortBus: Because molestation is more common then you realize. Far.. far more common. it happens every day in every town. It is done by strangers, by siblings, by teachers.

That said.. it SUCKS that any of us think of that first.

@floraposte: I can see where you are coming from, and I mostly agree on the merits. It's just the whole "They did this to me!!! *swoons*" victimhood thing.

Frankly, I think it's a cop-out to say she wasn't familiar with the TSA because I think most of who are wouldn't expect them to take a kid away from his or her parents.

I would never voluntarily give my (hypothetical) child to a stranger for any reason, regardless of whether they took the child out of sight or not. Though my reasons are more about the fact that these TSA people come into contact with thousands of people from around the world daily and who the hell knows what kind of microbes they have on their gloves. I would have held the kid out, arms outstretched a la Lion King, and let the guy pat him down. But I wouldn't let him hold the kid.

I think had she simply asked what they were intending to do and had them explain everything, things may have been less stressful for her. I guess hindsight is 20-20, but I'd tend to feel more sympathy if she did the right things THEN they fucked with her.

Not everyone is experienced with navigating TSA and airports (I have no clue if this Mom was or not).
Not everyone is calm and collected under pressure - and the TSA definitely applied pressure, on top of her time constraint pressure.

If it was me? Yes, I'd have reacted differently - I like to think I would have been a lot calmer (comments about cuffing the TSA goons aside). I like to think I would have been a lot more useful to myself and my kid.

But, unlike you, I refuse to judge another parent just because they don't react how I wish I would have reacted. She did nothing wrong, and you seem to be inferring she brought this on her self.

But that doesn't mean I'm right :)

I thought they'd just wand you if something beeped, anyway. Does anybody know why they would have done something so draconian instead?

Not everyone is experienced with navigating TSA and airports (I have no clue if this Mom was or not).
Not everyone is calm and collected under pressure - and the TSA definitely applied pressure, on top of her time constraint pressure.

If it was me? Yes, I'd have reacted differently - I like to think I would have been a lot calmer (comments about cuffing the TSA goons aside). I like to think I would have been a lot more useful to myself and my kid.

But, unlike you, I refuse to judge another parent just because they don't react how I wish I would have reacted. She did nothing wrong, and you seem to be inferring she brought this on her self.

@hi: and I consider freaking out by being confused not knowing what to do.. because these days they tazer people for less. This has to stop.

@Oranges w/ Cheese wants it to be winter already: She DID explain the situation, twice. You'll notice how much good that did. She could NOT have followed the kid. Have you ever tried to leave the holding area once the TSA have put you there? I agree that her actions were hardly the best choice, if she could be said to have had a choice, but you've yet to offer an alternative that would work.

It's ridiculous - a couple of years I had an experience where as soon as the monitor beeped, I knew exactly what it was. Being accustomed to these things at a previous job, I walked back through and attempted to take out the offensive object from my pocket. One TSA man yelled at me telling me to "DON'T GO BACK THROUGH THERE - STAY WHERE YOU ARE!" and another rushed me saying, "KEEP YOUR HANDS OUT OF YOUR POCKETS!"

@Oranges w/ Cheese wants it to be winter already: Anyone who doesn't freak out when a stranger takes their baby and walks away shouldn't be a parent.

She's not operating in my style either, but honestly, I don't think her changing the handling of the situation would really have altered what happened with her kid--save for her doing something that resulted in a more serious restraint by the TSA and a subsequent legal issue for her.

Hell I think I had two tries when I left my keys in my pocket before they pulled me aside to be wanded. No separate rape room or anything. Just a wand and then I was on my way.

Just put the little special on the conveyor belt through the scanner. "Time for a riiiiiide...bugaboo!"

WHOSE Homeland is this securing?

Read the policies yourself.

[www.tsa.gov]

Number 1 on the list is "We will not ask you to do anything that will separate you from your child or children."

This TSA agent needs to be fired, and deserves some time in prison for kidnapping a little boy. His pals that stood around watching it happening without intervening deserve to be fired and charged as accessories.

Obviously the baggage screeners were why 9/11 happened, didn't you know?

@amberlink: I agree with you that if the child was forcibly removed, she had every right to lose her shit. But she GAVE the kid over to the guy. What kind of mother would relinquish constructive possession to a baby to a complete stranger, badge or not? Then completely implode?

She seems like general basket case to me, and this is coming from someone who has dealt with panic attacks regularly over the past 8 years or so.

The TSA agents were out of line, and assholes about it to boot. They should be fired.

However, this woman is seriously overly dramatic. She handled this very poorly (she should at least be honest and admit that), and decided to let herself be victimized by giving control to the TSA rather than simply saying "Actually, no, you can't take my child, so figure something else out." For goodness sake, what is she going to do on the first day of Kindergarten?

I just feel bad for her son/husband who will have to deal with this craziness for the rest of her life.

@emis: The crime is kidnapping. If I did that to her kid, I would be behind bars. The TSA goon has the same rights as I do to take a child from his parents, namely NONE.

I think "redskull" expressed it far better than I did: "The public needs to demand a reversal of these asinine policies now."

The missing part is "the public" is us, where do we start?

@rondalescott: Amen brother. TSA employee taking my child away would definitely equal jail time for me.

Holy moly. These guys are criminal at worst, incompetent at best.

Why exactly are they necessary again?

@Applekid: Unless it was a robot baby.

@amberlink: Fuck yeah that's what I'm talking about. I have a 1 1/2 year old...if any fucking security guard tried to take her, I would probably be in jail that evening...

Most of the TSA agents I've dealt with have done their jobs with humor and intelligence, but every once in a while I find one who prefers intimidation, barking vague orders in a loud booming voice. The mother did ask if she could remove the pacifier before going back through the metal detector, and got "turn around and come back" as a non-answer. That's too bad, because your native tongue is such as easy tool to use in situations like this.

@Oranges w/ Cheese wants it to be winter already: "@cmdrsass: Please refer to the original post yourself, thanks."

Yeah. cmdrsass wasn't talking to you.

Don't get me wrong, it probably wouldn't be the smartest thing to do, but I guaranty it would shut down that terminal and put me face to face with a TSA supervisor in about 10 seconds. After that, between the aggravated kidnapping charge I would be insisting on for the TSA officer, along with the media exposure, my attorney would probably not have a big problem with making sure any charges were quickly dismissed.

I do believe that they intend to achieve their purpose, but what they actually achieve is a mixture of their purpose and what you two are talking about.

Oh, you mean that story about the crazy white terrorist who tried to use a baby as a bomb, and how the TSA saved the baby and the terrorist committed suicide in his holding cell to avoid divulging any information?

She told them that several times.

It doesn't matter, once you're into the flow-chart of being searched it just keeps going. You're better off being "docile and obedient" until the situation is resolved and then working on a campaign for change with your elected officials.

If you're attacked by a bear is the best thing to fight the bear or play dead? It's best to play dead. When the bear leaves you be you go get the ranger and kill the bear.

The TSA is like a chinese finger trap--once you're in it, struggling only makes it tighter, your best bet is to loosen up, remain calm and cooperate...

@LMacConn: In this case, stepping up would probably earn you a trip to jail and a one-way pass to the no-fly zone...I wouldn't do it.

In any case, whether or not they realized her condition is irrelevant. In a modern free society, you specifically don't treat people like the latest arrivals to the slave market or like new concentration camp inmates who you're testing for fitness, specifically because you know some people can't handle it.

You also don't take kids away from their parents because a metal detector went off.

Seriously, why do I have to even say these things? What is wrong with people? This is no-brainer stuff.

@GitEmSteveDave_#GitEmSteveDaveRocks: +1

She didn't do anything but throw a tantrum, which did nothing to get her son back to her any faster - in fact probably made the agents more frustrated. She could have explained the situation to them, she could have followed the kid. But instead she lost it, started crying, failed to form a coherent sentence and almost got herself arrested.

Another winner!

You'd probably wind up on a no-fly list as a result, you'd have to pay fees/fines, possibly hire a lawyer to deal with whatever charge they can figure out--creating a public disturbance, attempting to interfere w/ TSA operations, attempting to incite riot, whatever...

The best thing to do is to keep your eyes open and act as a calm and level-headed witness of the events.

If you SEE a crime, like the kid being molested off in the corner, THEN you open your mouth. But in this case you are not seeing a crime, you are seeing the TSA perform an uncomfortable task for the mother and son, but one that is completely within the scope of their directives.

Now, if you want to argue that TSA has a policy of not removing child from parent, and that they were violating that, then you speak to her afterward, hand her your card, you number, whatever and say "I saw what happened and if you need anyone to testify as a witness to what happened I will do it"...

...but running up to a TSA person and screaming at them will only serve to get you into a world of hurt and raise suspicion on this woman and child as to why some 3rd party is so interested in her getting through security--keep in mind they don't listen to logical arguments, they follow procedures, which is the #1 reason why you yelling at them will do nothing.

I specifically mentioned the Milgram experiment, "which measured the willingness of study participants to obey an authority figure who instructed them to perform acts that conflicted with their personal conscience." (copied from wikipedia) The TSA frequently violates their own policies, and in this case separated a mother from her child. I assume there were other people in line witnessing this, and if so they seem to have chosen to not get involved.

They may not have condoned it, but they didn't seem to care enough to do anything about it. I'm not saying they should have thrown punches or incited a riot, but couldn't someone ask a question or gotten involved in some way not likely to risk their own safety or freedom?

Er, no. The entire purpose is security theater -- the illusion of safety. It is trivially easy to beat their so-called security, whether it is smuggling weapons or liquids in larger quantities than their arbitrary 3 oz limit, or printing fake boarding passes so as to avoid their "secondary" security screenings.

Unfortunately, this actually makes us *LESS SAFE*, because now most people believe they're safe, so they are less vigilant.

@revmatty is spot on: most security researchers view the TSA as a pathetic joke.

I doubt there's any way we can carry around badges with "ANXIOUS" on it. I'm not sure that's even a good idea. But her agitation probably just made the already terrible TSA agents even more suspicious. "Oh she has something to hide!" It's like how a cop who pulled me over sees how nervous I am and thinks I must be dealing drugs so he demands to search my car.

But the TSA people didn't have to know anything about anyone's medical condition. They just had to see her as a human and not a potential terrorist.

@emis: I think the rule of thumb should be 2 hours (on average) for a group of adults and add 30 minutes for each child under 12. Add 1 hour for an infant.

Umm... you'd yell "BOMB" at the top of your lungs after they took your kid?

That does not make much sense, and I seriously doubt that will result in a reunion w/ your kid any faster then if you held your tongue, allowed the situation to run it's course and then began a sane and composed letter writing campaign and calls to your elected officials, local news agencies and the folks in charge of TSA PR and operations.

@vdragonmpc: Same goes for you.

Oh yeah, that'll go over real well... they take your kid and you try to physically attack a TSA person? You think those knuckle dragers aren't just DYING to get a chance to club a passenger?

That's why half of them go into the biz in the first place, didn't make the cut as a police officer, don't want the military, so they join this joke organization.... and the other half just want the chance after having to listen to hundreds of whiners all day.

You go ahead and try to hand out that beat down...

I was actually suprised (though glad they understood) the Gate people let her on the plane, given some of the articles on here recently about "angry or upset" passengers.

...it sounds like they put her in plastic box for a while first... so it wasn't like this was all being done quickly, so I have to admit, after 10 mins of waiting in a box I'd be impatient too.

...and told her what they were doing, I'm not sure... they told her they needed to inspect him and pat him down... not remove him to some other area where you aren't present, my guess is that she would have protested and not given him up--which is probably why they were so vague about it, they know that they need the kid alone for 2-3 minutes and that most mother's won't allow it.

All in all it sounds like it was a confluence of bad things... the TSA's procedures are too rigid and involve some semi-ridiculous waits for no good reason.

And this lady is apparently on the verge of emotional wreck 24/7 (carries an "emergency xanax"?) ... and she didn't allow enough time for delays---that's the thing, they tell you to allow for 2 hours for domestic, but people figure that if the average is not 2 hours then you don't need it, and so they do things like this lady did which is show up such that you've only got ~45 mins until take off (let alone boarding).

I feel for her, and I think the TSA needs to do something about these situations so that they don't occur--at Boston's airport I've noticed lines for families w/ children, so I assume that those TSA agents are better instructed in how to deal with parents and children ... and by having that line available it reduces the delays for the lines of business travelers and other adult-only travelers.

But... mental note to myself, if I ever travel with a kid on an airplane i'm allowing 3 hours to get from front door to gate!

Whats your point? We'd all react differently - I see nothing wrong with a mother (with anxiety problems to begin with) being extremely upset at some TSA monkey walking off with her child without *clearly* communicating what was going on.

Why is she wrong?

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALT!!!!

THEY TOOK MY BOY!!!!

Her reaction, while not considered acceptable for people without such a condition, was both normal and hardly controllable. Hopefully, the TSA learned their lesson because we do not ban people with these kinds of medical conditions from flying.

Thanks

Not really. The main point of the TSA is to engage in security theater so people who don't pay any attention feel more secure while in fact having no impact on actual safety. Few security or terrorism experts have much faith in TSA, and that includes much of the TSA itself.

One of my favorite examples is from Greg Laden, but you can find plenty more at Bruce Schneier's site.

When she started doing that she went from concerned to bat-shit crazy lady, and with the TSA unfortunately that can mean arrest.

On one hand, TSA needs to stop being so Fear-inducing. On the other hand, people need to stop taking their shit.

Her reaction was overblown though. They shouldn't have taken her kid, but she shouldn't have turned into a babbling pile of mush either.

Bull puckies, and no, that is NOT a swear. It is an epithet, and you swear AT them not TO them unless she was taking some sort of oath. So, either she doesn't know how to make that distinction or she needs someone to teach her to write what she means.

ALL ASIDE. Someone takes my child, I WILL hunt them down, skin them, and feed said skin back to them. There is NO VALID REASON for anyone taking a child away who does not have the authority or the right to do so. This was a breach of their own regulations.

Fire the f***er (that was a swear).

@outlulz: Why not? I have kids and wine.. one often leads to the other.

They BARELY gave them background checks. To make them legitimate-ish, they gave them badges.

FIRE THEM ALL. I see the dips in the airport and the collective brain they share is so small it could fit in a thimble.

These people are a perfect example of the smaller the job, the bigger the personal ego.

Air travel is always going to carry some risk. It will never be 100% safe, no matter how many misguided policies they put into effect.

The public needs to demand a reversal of these asinine policies now.

And I'd stand up in front of judge, jury, God and country and promise to do it again if necessary.

No one, but no one, takes my child from me without my permission or one hell of a fight.

I don't know who these fools think they are, but all of us better start wising up to the fact that a government given unbridled control over its population is a deep and abiding menace to us all.

@Oranges w/ Cheese wants it to be winter already: Her decision not to follow her son was more than likely due to the culture of fear at American airports, where TSA officials practically threaten you with arrest if you sneeze.

(I'm being facetious, but I do think she probably didn't feel comfortable following a TSA official into what is presumably a restricted area, where she could get in trouble.)

...a lot of clinical anxiety conditions involve internalizing stress to the point of paralysis. If she's prone to panic attacks, she's extremely unlikely to lash out. Panic attacks for some people are like falling down a well.

Had the mother had some sense of her own rights she might have had the gumption to say, "No, the problem is the pacifier clip." and then hand the clip to the TSA agent.

We turning into a police state. It is more than merely theater of security: It is alarming.

I don't think she overreacted.. my very first, and most sickening, thought was what he could do to sexually abuse that baby in 10 minutes.

Jesus...yeah, she may have overreacted, but I probably would have as well. You don't remove a baby from a parent, but people are so gunshy of TSA agents these days, that they feel helpless when one goes off the deep end.

Reading her post made me almost feel as though I was about to have a panic attack of my own. I can't imagine what I would have done had I been in that situation. I can't even begin to guess, but the near-panic reaction I almost had just now leads me to believe that it would have involved jail time.

You guys realize that TSA employees are glorified fucking Wal-mart receipt-checkers, right? These people are the "warm bodies" the TSA pulled off the street, gave background checks, and crammed through their pathetic two-week training course. These people, on many well-documented, repeated occasions, have proven unable to prevent any kind of explosives or weapons smuggling, have proven highly untrustworthy of the enormous power placed in their incompetent, grasping fingers, have proven criminal and dishonest (there have been more than one TSA-sheltered luggage-theft rings exposed.)

Now given that track record, would you be okay with them walking off with your toddler? Walking out of your sight, for many minutes, in direct contradiction of their own posted regulations? After locking you in a plastic box and tossing snotty, Burger King drive-through employee level comments your way?

And this poor lady has a diagnosed clinical anxiety condition. I'm astonished she didn't go postal and start clawing peoples' eyes out.

Folks, the TSA works FOR US. They are OUR EMPLOYEES. It's time to fire them.

Considering TSA's abusiveness of personal rights, i'd probably be escorted out of the airport, since no police department would arrest me for defending some poor mother and her child, nor for berating the jerk that took the kid away from her.

BTW, she was told "Stay here so I can search you"
I'm sure if she tried to follow the agent, they'd tase her and issue a press release about how a crazed woman tried to rush through security and had to be stopped for the safety of everyone.

I wonder if that woman could have or should have called 911 at that point and reported a kidnapping. I would have gladly missed my flight to press charges if it was me but then again I would have been tazed to death for chasing down a person carrying my child away.

I'm a guy. And, don't ever separate a child from EITHER parent.

@Oranges w/ Cheese wants it to be winter already: Ok I just read it and I think you are misunderstanding her. She KNOWS they took him.. she meant they did not tell her WHERE they took him. That child NEVER should have been taken out of his mothers site. She carried Xanax and obviously has Panic Disorder, a medical condition. TSA agents threatened her and treated her badly, she got upset.. as would most any mother.

You never, ever, ever know how you would act in the same situation.

However, I'm not wholly surprised. I traveled to visit some friends about two years ago and my ticket was marked for extra security or something, and I had to go through the whole stand aside and pat-down thing. Which annoyed me but I cooperated and boy, the agents are really nasty no matter how calm you are. I had never gone through that kind of security before and they just bark at you to stand over here, wait, be quiet... it's really unsettling and it becomes very clear very quickly that you have no rights whatsoever in that situation.

The TSA really needs to be retooled or dismantled before things get worse.

From the sound of it they didn't have a table or anything to inspect the baby on, it was just a box.

NOT ONCE, did she even try to follow her son, she just lost it and started freaking out.

I do think that the lady overreacted a bit, but in the context of recent stories where the TSA puts you in holding cells unsupervised for hours and so forth, I can also understand a parent not knowing what to do, or what to expect from TSA in this situation, and also being afraid of being persecuted by them.

I think that the moral of the story is, if the TSA would stop using FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt) as a tool against civilians to do their job, then these situations would not happen.

She's not inventing what the TSA site promises; it's right here: [www.tsa.gov] And they didn't keep to that.

Remember, the entire purpose here is to keep us safe. Regardless of whether or not the mother overreacted or not, there are much more appropriate ways to handle these situations which do not compromise anyone's safety. That is the real point here. What happened was not necessary.

Seriously, how is this guy not getting fired?

They told her what they were doing.

The security guard for Orlando Airport had to jump in and push the TSA agent away before he hit me and tell him that was illegal I did nothing wrong.

The TSA needs to be put on the list of government programs that MUST be shut down. All it is is another cog in the terror industrial complex, creating jobs through fear.

@amberlink: I So agree.. retraining him is a waste.. let him go work at Walmart. There are lots of kids for the taking there.

@Oranges w/ Cheese wants it to be winter already: She may not have been able too. She may have had other children or been behind a barricade or a million other reasons.

As a mother, by the way, she has every right to have a tantrum because she was 'removed from her little special'.

She's contradicting herself and obviously overreacting.

Sorry, massive visceral reaction to child being taken away from a parent.