var json_comments = new Array("
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johnfrombrooklyn
September 22, 2009 2:16 PM
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One small victory for unions. One giant loss for consumers.

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5 replies
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econobiker
September 22, 2009 2:25 PM
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@johnfrombrooklyn: No, one small victory for all American workers, not unions.


If we outsource all our manufacturing to China who will be left to be \"consumers\"?

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Traveshamockery
September 22, 2009 6:03 PM
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@econobiker:

If we outsource all our manufacturing to China who will be left to be \"consumers\"?

A massive trade deficit isn't a good thing, but there is more to our economy than manufacturing jobs.

Our country's future is in intangible goods like software and other tech, service jobs, banking, etc.

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econobiker
September 22, 2009 9:22 PM
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@Traveshamockery: You mean those service jobs taken by recent ~immigrants~ such as a Boston Hyatt firing $15/hr+benefit workers for an outside service probably staffed with recent ~immigrants~?


Or all those call center jobs sent to India?

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Orv
September 22, 2009 9:38 PM
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@econobiker: Yup. And the thing about the aforementioned \"intangible products\" like software is they can be made anywhere...those were some of the first jobs to be outsourced.

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Orv
September 22, 2009 6:20 PM
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@Traveshamockery: Yeah, because relying on the banking sector to support the economy worked so well for Iceland...

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EBounding
September 22, 2009 2:40 PM
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@econobiker:
All this helps is the US tire business and the Union bosses, not the workers. It doesn't help the workers because there's not going to be any more demand for these tires, which is why the tariff was imposed in the first place. So they're not going to get any more hours or pay increases.

But it does hurt anyone who has a car and needs tires.

The US is still the world leader in manufacturing anyway. The US just manufactures capital intensive and high tech items like medical equipment, drugs, jet engines, and semi-conductors.

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Aesteval
September 22, 2009 4:10 PM
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@EBounding: drugs and semiconductors have been leaving the country. They may not quite disappear yet, but it's not the same world that it used to be.

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NeverLetMeDown
September 22, 2009 2:35 PM
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@econobiker:


Well, I bet if we put punitive tariffs on _all_ imports, then things would be perfect, huh? Smoot-Hawley worked so well, after all.

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econobiker
September 22, 2009 9:35 PM
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@NeverLetMeDown: China is basically exporting its lack of social support systems ( bird flu anyone?) and its ability to allow unfettered dumping of toxic wastes in the local rivers and landfills with impunity.


In the future, I foresee the Chinese gov't going to the UN to make the Western Countries pay up for the clean up of industrial waste caused by mass production of goods in China. By then all the exec's Walmart, et al will have already gotten their bonuses, moved production factories to the Sudan, Chad, or Nigeria, and then retired...


I think there should be an environmental tariff on Chinese goods importation...

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fredbiscotti
September 22, 2009 5:03 PM
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@NeverLetMeDown: There's a reason that China is terrified of tariffs. What are they going to prevent the US from selling? Chicken feet? Oh no!

I just got back from Europe. They pay a little more for things there, but they also have high-quality products, made in Europe, by Europeans. And they have a stronger economy than the US.

I'm sick and tired of the US propping up other economies, especially when they're the economies of nations that are our economic enemies.

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Traveshamockery
September 22, 2009 6:06 PM
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@fredbiscotti:

And they have a stronger economy than the US.

Uh...by what measure, and for what period of time? We're in the second worst economic rut in the country's history, involved in two wars, and we're still rated the second most competitive national economy in the world. (source: [feeds.bignewsnetwork.com])
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pecan 3.14159265
September 22, 2009 2:19 PM
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Lord, help me. I need more coffee. I read the headline and thought, \"why is someone charging Bradley Cooper more for tires?\" And then that led to the requisite \"Hangin' with Mr. Cooper\" episode in which Mr. Cooper gives some kind of moral lesson in the form of a basketball analogy, which is more or less all of the episodes.


But on topic...anyone know enough about tires to tell me how cheap can I go before getting a bad deal? I have no idea how to pick tires, and I don't think we'll need to replace ours anytime soon since our car is only a year old, but all it takes is a really sharp piece of metal to ruin a good tire, and they're starting to do a lot of construction on nearby roads.

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usul356
September 22, 2009 7:14 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: One option you can look for is something like a Road Hazard Warranty. A lot of times this will allow for free flat fixes and prorated tire replacement if something does happen.

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Traveshamockery
September 22, 2009 6:10 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: Don't buy a 50,000 mile tire if you're only going to have your car for 20k more miles.

Basically, pick a brand you trust (I don't screw around with off-brand tires), and pick the application (probably all-weather if you're not in the north), and pick the distance you want them to go before replacement (generally 20k-50k is the range of options).

Shop for prices, and don't be afraid to show an internet price to your local shop if you're a loyal customer. They probably can't match the price, but they may come down a few bucks.

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Jakuub
September 22, 2009 5:50 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: You should really never be asking \"how cheap can I go\" about tires to begin with - they're the single most important safety item in your car. Read reviews, find the best tire for your specific application, and buy that. Anything else is gambling.

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TheWillow
September 22, 2009 3:21 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: if it makes you feel better, your comment about basketball + TV + life lessons made me think of the White Shadow, which reminded me that Ken Howard won an emmy, which reminded me that during the awards I wiki'd him and found out he was Thomas Jefferson in 1776 and was even more awesome than I'd ever remembered.

(I only use tires for swings though)

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ElizabethD
September 22, 2009 5:25 PM
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@TheWillow:

\"The White Shadow\" was one of my favorite shows of all time! You can see episodes on Hulu now.

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Jfielder
September 22, 2009 3:20 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: I've worked in the Automotive vulcanized rubber application industry (AKA, tire bitch) for a long time, and I can safely say, you get what you pay for in tires. For the money, Toyo's and Yokohama's are good. Kumho's are good, but don't last a real long time. Cooper's are decent (a branch of Goodyear) Stay away from anything with names like Nankang... I have one personal rule for buying tires: Where was it made? The only acceptable answer is US, Brazil, France, Japan, Canada. Tires from just about everywhere else (generally speaking) are junk. But in the end, spend a few more bucks, get a premium tire (Goodyear, Michelin, Firestone [ignore the bad rap, they are great tires], Bridgestone, etc.) and you will get a longer lasting, more comfortable riding tire.

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Kimaroo - 100% Pure Natural Kitteh
September 22, 2009 3:07 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: I remember liking that show.. but I don't remember why.


I don't even like basketball.

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danger the pirate
September 22, 2009 2:30 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: check out tirerack.com. i've always had good experiences with yokohamas.

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jeffbone
September 23, 2009 2:40 AM
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@danger the pirate: Big +1 for Tire Rack. They put country of origin/manufacture information in the detail portion of each tire description. I just put a set of Dunlop Sport Signatures on my car; after rebate, I came out ahead of even Costco's pricing *and* they're US-made, to boot.

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Alvarez
September 22, 2009 2:44 PM
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@danger the pirate: Yokohama's are good. What I've learned from my experience with shopping for cheap reliable tires over about the 11 years that I've been driving so far (with 5 different cars/trucks) is to shop around. Check websites of companies in your city (they'll usually show what's in stock ready to go or just call). And check reviews online when you find a prospective tire type. All common sense stuff I guess, but it pays to be careful and informed when tires are concerned.

Also on my older cars I bought used from a friend who actually owns a small tire repair shop. He can't get new ones at good prices but he's honest and cheap for the plugs/used tires.

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Nighthawke
September 22, 2009 2:21 PM
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Cooper tires are crap anyway. I had a set on my truck and they didn't last 50K miles. The right rear finally broke its belt and nearly put me into the ditch. The poor truck shook like a cocktail mixer until I got it to a tire shop.

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3 replies
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CFinWV
September 22, 2009 3:32 PM
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@Nighthawke: I wonder if it's a truck thing, I have them on my car and they've been great so far.

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Nighthawke
September 22, 2009 5:03 PM
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@CFinWV: I seriously doubt it. Cooper's been having QA issues for awhile now. THe sidewall cracked around the rim, a consistent crack. The installer said it was normal and didn't make any move to replace them. I was not in a posistion at the time to buy another set.

But when the cord fractured, I had the money to go to a better brand and something more suited for my driving on caliche roads.

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keepher
September 22, 2009 3:30 PM
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@Nighthawke: I won't put them on my truck again because they make so much road noise it sounds like my front differential is this close to failing. But at least now I know why they suck, they were made in China.

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Hoss
September 22, 2009 2:22 PM
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Hey Cooper -- tarriffs are supposed to reduce imports...hint, hint

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1 replies
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Traveshamockery
September 22, 2009 6:11 PM
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@Hoss: And their reduced sales will either boost domestically made competitors, or cause them to bring some manufacturing back in-country, in theory.

Of course, short term, it'll just mean a higher average selling price for consumers.

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CAJensen01
September 22, 2009 2:27 PM
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You guys are missing the realities of our economy in the United States. Companies who have mfg. facilities in the United States have had to drastically reduce prices to remain competitive with cheap chinese imports. Cooper has lost money the last five quarters because they simply couldn't compete against the cheap chinese even at the prices they were at. They were forced to close a plant in Georgia, and one in Findlay, OH, employing 1,100 is threatened.

If I have to pay $5-$10 per tire to keep Americans employed and making tires, then I'm completely for it. The adverse affect of having 1,100 more people not having purchasing power to support all kinds of other companies is a worse outcome.

Companies with mfg. facilities in the US can finally return to profitability with tariffs.

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5 replies
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shepd
September 22, 2009 2:42 PM
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@CAJensen01:

Sounds like a great idea if you only want Americans to buy American tires.

To go from 100% of the world population wanting your products to 5% is probably not the *intended* effect, but is the *actual* end effect of protectionist trade measures.

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CAJensen01
September 22, 2009 3:39 PM
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@shepd: How so? They also have mfg. facilities outside the US, as most other tire companies do. It just allows the ones that they do have in the US, which produces tires for the US, to actually be competitive in the US market. They have factories in China too.

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shepd
September 22, 2009 4:36 PM
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@CAJensen01:

If you increase the taxes on goods imported INTO your country, then the other countries retaliate by increasing taxes on goods exported FROM your country to theirs, OR they increase taxes on goods exported from their country TO yours.

Consider the result:

Goods in the US go up in price, as all import prices go up, why would local businesses not take the opportunity to increase prices? Americans feel good that they're buying American.

Goods in the other countries remain at the same price as only a small percentage of the goods increase in price. The goods that are not competitive are not purchased. People from that country don't really care because there's no patriotism in imports anyways.

Net result? Cost of living for those in the US goes up, cost of living elsewhere in the world is completely unaffected. The US becomes a poorer nation, albeit a prouder one.

The above is setup to happen with American steel shortly, as our prime minister hasn't convinced your president it's a bad idea; I expect once the law is enacted we'll be greatly increasing tariffs on US imported steel. China has plenty of steel to offer us to compensate for the lack of US steel. Not to mention we have our own steel factories.

On goods where the US would be the sole (or nearly sole) producer, normally what will happen is the other countries will retaliate by increasing export tariffs on goods the US relies on (Especially if the other country is a sole producer--eg: Canada could retaliate against the US steel measures via increased lumber export tariffs).

Pretty much the textbook definition of \"Trade War\". Although if it's only practiced against China, they don't tend to retaliate for some reason...

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CAJensen01
September 22, 2009 6:32 PM
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Perhaps because we're driving their economy?

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fredbiscotti
September 22, 2009 5:17 PM
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@shepd: If only we were exporting goods, that argument might have weight.

[www.americaneconomicalert.org]

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Orv
September 22, 2009 6:23 PM
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@fredbiscotti: The sad thing is, increasingly our trade looks like a third-world country, or a colony...we export low-value raw materials like recycled cardboard to China, and get high-value finished goods back.

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NeverLetMeDown
September 22, 2009 2:34 PM
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@CAJensen01:


There are ~225 million vehicles in the US. Say each needs a new set of tires every 3 years, so 75 million sets, or 300 million tires/year. At $5/tire, that's $1.5 billion/year out of US consumers' pockets. If that saves 1000 jobs, that's $1.5 million/year/job. Seems like a pretty lousy deal to me.


Nobody's saying you can't pay extra for tires, or saying that you can't send a check every month to Cooper or Cooper's employees. Just don't make the rest of us do it.

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swonder911
September 23, 2009 12:53 AM
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@NeverLetMeDown:

thank you. this is exactly how people need to look at it, including the huge deadweight loss to consumers that is inherent in this sort of protectionism.

It's funny that the pro-consumer attitude that is so prevalent on this blog suddenly goes out the window when this sort of issue comes along. Which side are you on, exactly, people?

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CAJensen01
September 22, 2009 3:37 PM
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@NeverLetMeDown: Yeah.. if everyone in the US was buying cooper tires, I don't think they'd be losing money. So while it may be fun to make up random numerical statistics with no basis on the reality and scope of the situation, it doesn't make for a good argument.

But as per the argument of not making everyone else pay more for American products -- if you don't effectively want any mfg. jobs to remain in the United States then I guess that's a good argument.

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NeverLetMeDown
September 22, 2009 4:29 PM
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@CAJensen01:


The #s I gave are illustrative of a simple point - tariffs always cause significant deadweight loss. If you want the government to transfer money from tire consumers to US tire workers, it's always more efficient to just put a tax on tires, and write checks to the workers. Of course, no politician wants to do that, so they choose the \"protecting the American worker\" angle and impose tariffs. The net impact on the consumer is the same though.

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friendlynerd
September 22, 2009 2:31 PM
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Precisely why my car is at the shop right now getting tires before this all happens.

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Notsewfast
September 22, 2009 2:33 PM
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Its a good thing I replaced my old-fashioned rubber tires with these:

The downside is that I have to spray for termites...

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5 replies
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pecan 3.14159265
September 22, 2009 2:55 PM
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@Notsewfast: I think it's time for some chrome spinners.

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Hoss
September 22, 2009 3:17 PM
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@pecan 3.14159265: Where's the grill on that car -- and what's that box where the gas/petro goes? Electric?

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Notsewfast
September 22, 2009 3:37 PM
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@Hoss: It's a rear-engined sedan. That is the 'grill'.

Even thought I have to change the wheels every 5,000 miles, I still have the most poplar car in town!

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admiral_stabbin
September 22, 2009 2:52 PM
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@Notsewfast: Are those dubs?

I bet you get great traction in the winter time too...look at those tree rings!

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thesadtomato
September 22, 2009 2:53 PM
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@thesadtomato: Argh! Bad typing.


How I knew it was Europe: Cars? No. License plates? No. Graffiti? Yes!

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Blueskylaw
September 22, 2009 2:34 PM
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By \"up to 12 percent\" means it will go up 12 percent.


On another note, I thought tarrifs on imported tires meant that domestic tire prices should trend downward.

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3 replies
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NeverLetMeDown
September 22, 2009 3:10 PM
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@Blueskylaw:


Why would that happen? If you're a business, and your competitors are forced to (effectively) raise prices, why would you _lower_ your prices?

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Blueskylaw
September 22, 2009 5:38 PM
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@NeverLetMeDown:


I put in the disclaimer \"should\" trend downward, knowing that they won't is pretty obvious to most people.

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NeverLetMeDown
September 22, 2009 6:20 PM
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@Blueskylaw:


But why \"should\" they trend downward? Maybe I'm thick, but the statement doesn't make any sense to me from any angle, neither from the \"really ought to morally\" sense of should, nor from the \"is expected to\" sense of should.

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Hoss
September 22, 2009 3:10 PM
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@Blueskylaw: I don't think you got the economics right; tarrifs deter buying from the taxed country by attempting to eliminate the cost difference. So, if the tarrif was set appropriately, the cost of tires from China will now approach domestic and non-tarrifed makers. There's no incentive for domestic makers to reduce pricing

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econobiker
September 22, 2009 2:35 PM
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At least that doesn't affect the used tire / junk yard tire pricing...


In late 2007 I hit the junkyard jackpot for my Dodge Neon tires-4 x 14\" matched-style Dunlops DOT date coded to late 2006 already mounted on Neon rims and barely used!
Purchase of wheels with rims: $60 (about $13 each)
NTB coupon to balance (and rotate): $25
Now have about 20,000 on those


Typical used tire places charge $15-20 per tire w/ mounting plus $5-$10 extra for balance.


This is true recycling...

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2 replies
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henrygates
September 22, 2009 2:53 PM
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@econobiker: Great find. I was a true junk yard hound for my cars in my high school days.

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econobiker
September 22, 2009 9:25 PM
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@henrygates: I remain a junk yard hound due to the after affects of a divorce...


At least she cannot say I am living above my means...

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halcyondays
September 22, 2009 2:48 PM
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One thing I won't skimp on is tires. You are taking a big chance putting cheap Chinese junk on your car. I'll pay extra and get better-made American tires.

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4 replies
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catnapped
September 22, 2009 7:11 PM
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@halcyondays: Weren't the infamous Firestone Ford Explorer tires Chinese?

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TheSpatulaOfLove
September 22, 2009 2:56 PM
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@halcyondays:

You and I are in the minority here. I never understood the whole 'just give me black and round' when they haul their kids around in said vehicle...

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Jfielder
September 22, 2009 3:28 PM
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@TheSpatulaOfLove: Haha, I love the \"black round and hold air\" crowd. At the shop I used to work at we had these tires called SBR's... Stood for \"Steel Belted Radial\". That was the name of the tire.... Seriously.... And we sold them to every idiot that walked in and said \"I want the cheapest tires I can get.\" and then they'd be upset when they lasted 12k miles... Congrats, you saved 80 dollars.

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Orv
September 22, 2009 6:25 PM
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@Jfielder23: I recently bought a Saab project car that had \"Widetrack Radials\" mounted. That was the name on the tire. Granted, it's not easy to find decent tires in such a narrow size (165/80R15, should really be 155/80R15 because they rub) but wow. They're all dry rotted now, too, look pretty scary.

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admiral_stabbin
September 22, 2009 2:56 PM
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I just bought a set of retreads for my winter beater Jeep from a business in South Dakota (TreadWright). It's too bad they only do truck tires...I saved a bundle, received an awesome set of tires, supported a small American business, and kept four tires out of a landfill.

It was hard getting over my negative perceptions of retreads...but, some research and an open mind helped. So far, I'm glad on every level that I made the decision.

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Orv
September 22, 2009 6:26 PM
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@admiral_stabbin: I've heard good things about Green Diamond retread snow tires, too.

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Banned in DC
September 22, 2009 3:18 PM
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As I understand it, the new tariffs are a victory for the Steelworkers union, which brought the lawsuit (tire workers are part of that union). It mostly covered the cheaper ranges of tire brands, which are almost entirely manufactured outside the US (China, Mexico, and Brazil mainly).

The new tariffs only affect Chinese tires, so it really will just push some tire production out of China and into the other cheap tire manufacturing centers. There will probably be no change to US tire manufacturing. The upper ends of tire lines will still be produced in the US. The cheaper side of the spectrum will still be imported.

This case is small potatoes, really, but was seen as an easy test case for future trade restriction suits to be brought by companies and unions.

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Trai_Dep
September 22, 2009 4:32 PM
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@jyindc: But the tariffs are based on allegations of dumping, which is a Free Trade no-no.
Or, are you in favor of dumping?

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Inail
September 22, 2009 4:27 PM
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Have there been problems or recalls with Chinese tires?

My car came with them (Toyo brand, made in China) and I've been thinking of changing over to Canadian or American made only because of where the tires are made, but haven't seen anything adverse about tires made in China. There was one recall for an off brand trailer tire -- that's all I could find.

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sonneillon
September 22, 2009 4:34 PM
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While we are talking about tires. Every time I get Pirelli tires the damn thing gets a hole in it within 3 months and it is never covered. Yet with the cheapest tires I can wear them down to bald. I am convinced the Chinese are better at making tires than the Italians.

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Trai_Dep
September 22, 2009 8:16 PM
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@sonneillon: You do realize that Perellis are performance tires, right? At least the ones that I bought were made to grip the road better (which means, softer rubber, which means shorter life).

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sonneillon
September 23, 2009 5:14 AM
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@Trai_Dep: Yes and they were great for that, but they should last longer than a few months.

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LastVigilante
September 22, 2009 6:15 PM
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@sonneillon: I'm fine with my Pirelli's, but yeah, if you keep having problems then stop buying them. Also, isn't it usually its the place where you buy & install the tires that will give you a puncture warranty or pro-rated tread replacement deal. FYI, Pirelli is HQ in Italy but the tires are manufactured all over, including a plant in Atlanta.

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ElizabethD
September 22, 2009 5:21 PM
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@sonneillon:
So, um, why do you keep buying Pirelli tires?

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sonneillon
September 23, 2009 5:12 AM
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@ElizabethD: I have stopped, but I gave them 2 tries.

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enine
September 22, 2009 4:49 PM
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There are a few posts on rv forums where people were buying trailers over the last couple years that had chinese made tires which were blowing out with very few miles on them. Replacing with US made and they last years and many miles.

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2 replies
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Aesteval
September 22, 2009 4:57 PM
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@enine: Was it just an origin issue? Are they certain that the tires were rated for the application they put them through? Different tires do have weight and use limits as to what they can handle. Could be that the tires weren't meant for the job and it may not be an issue with the source of origin. Yes there's an issue at play somewhere with the tires blowing out, but more details are needed to determine exactly why.

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enine
September 23, 2009 1:39 AM
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@Aesteval:

Yes, because the manufacturer of the tires that blow under warranty was replacing them with the exact same tire,just made in the US.
I've ran into the same issue, once was rotors made in china bad out of the box, the other was replacing a U joint three times because it was made in china and finally getting an older box of the same brand and model but US made.

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ElizabethD
September 22, 2009 5:20 PM
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Random, but don't you just love the smell of brand new tires all lined up in a store? I remember as a kid going with my dad to the big \"service station\" (not so many of those these days) and just INHALING the Goodyear, or was it Goodrich, display.

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Snarkysnake
September 22, 2009 5:46 PM
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I personally demand tires not made in China for my vehicles. My kids and my wife ride on them. If that makes the \"free trade\" crowd mad ,tough shit.

See ,everything comes down to money with these wing nuts. Family dies in a fiery crash ? That's fine, as long as they can sell cheap stuff to everyone ,take the money and strip more companies (and their jobs) out of our economy and make even more money. Lather ,rinse ,repeat.

I guess that I am like a lot of folks that are just tired of the whole public policy debate being driven by what's good for Wall Street and wherever it sends our good jobs, not to mention selling unsafe, poisonous and downright dangerous products in the name of \"free trade\".

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NeverLetMeDown
September 22, 2009 6:22 PM
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@Snarkysnake:


Nobody is saying that you should be forced to buy Chinese-made tires if you don't want to. By the same token, who are you to tell me I can't put those tires on my car if I choose to?


Also, for the record, no party in this discussion (either pro or anti tariffs) is making any claim that these tires are substandard or unsafe - in fact, the unions are complaining because they good tires at prices that US manufacturers can't match.

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Snarkysnake
September 22, 2009 9:53 PM
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@NeverLetMeDown:

\"who are you to tell me I can't put those tires on my car if I choose to?\"

Pay the tarriff. Buy the tires. Demand Chinese quality.

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Orv
September 22, 2009 6:27 PM
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@NeverLetMeDown: I suppose, but if the Chinese can't make valve stems that don't disintegrate how much do you trust their tires? Just sayin'...
[blogs.consumerreports.org]

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NeverLetMeDown
September 22, 2009 7:16 PM
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@Orv:


Yes, because all Chinese companies are the same, and all related products are identical. The Ford Pinto, made of American-made steel, was a dangerous car, so the Empire State Building (also made of American-made steel) is a deathtrap.

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Orv
September 22, 2009 8:33 PM
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@NeverLetMeDown: I get your point. But it seems like the natural order of things there is to cheapen products as much as possible, without regard for safety or durability. There's essentially no safety regulation on the part of the Chinese government. This is why we got defective valve stems, power strips with under-sized wiring, and children's toys with lead in them, among other things.

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Rectilinear Propagation
September 22, 2009 6:38 PM
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@Jakuub: Not the brakes?

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Orv
September 22, 2009 6:40 PM
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@Rectilinear Propagation: How fast you can stop actually depends more on your tires than on your brakes, as long as the brakes are good enough to reach wheel lock-up. (Which is generally the case.)

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Inail
September 22, 2009 6:50 PM
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Can someone link to a report of a dangerous, even questionable, automotive tire made in China?

It might be one thing they've done right.

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lannister80
September 22, 2009 7:13 PM
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Meh, just buy Continental tires. Great value.

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nstonep
September 23, 2009 7:56 AM
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@lannister80: Continental tires are garbage. If you want dirt cheap you'd be better off with General tires.

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Mr.Duke
September 22, 2009 8:10 PM
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So much for free trade.

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TVarmy
September 22, 2009 10:13 PM
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That's it. I'm replacing the rear two tires with skis, like on a toboggan. That'll end my dependence on big vulcanized rubber.

By the time the front two tires wear out, I predict we will have jet engines that fit in their place.

Low sleep seems to affect my ability to imagineer vehicles.

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Panamapeter
September 22, 2009 11:00 PM
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Discount Tires, Arizonian model, I used these on taxis I owned. They outlasted and out performed ANY other tire I tried. (20 yeas ago)

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frodolives35
September 23, 2009 1:51 AM
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To hell with free trade how about fair trade. What do you suppose is the standard of living of a Chinese tire worker. There will be plenty of jobs coming back to the USA as soon as we are all ready to work for $1.00 an hour to keep from starving.

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nstonep
September 23, 2009 7:54 AM
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No no no...folks...you're doing it all wrong. If you buy CHINESE tires make sure they come from a CHINESE company. That way there's no \"American brand\" markup.

I believe the major Chinese tire brand is called \"GITI\" tires. They're actually not bad...not bad at all.

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mrearly2
September 23, 2009 9:05 PM
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Just another devious plan, to make it more expensive to own and use a car...

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