![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-542681-100x100.png\")
Um. That is the saddest picture ever.
Also, I'm really liking the high school vibe of this whole exchange.
Petland will certainly be \"taking this seriously\" I'm sure.
1 replies
Um. That is the saddest picture ever.
Also, I'm really liking the high school vibe of this whole exchange.
Petland will certainly be \"taking this seriously\" I'm sure.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-489342-100x100.png\")
Wow. Petland being blown up by animal rights psychos in 3...2...1...
![\"user-pic\"](\"/css/images/default.gif\")
@nicemarmot617: It would hilarious (and unsurprising) if they did that and killed all the animals inside in the process :D
@acklenheights: That would make the animal rights psychos in question PETA. They seem to deeply enjoy murdering innocent pets.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-357824-100x100.png\")
@nicemarmot617: Not only do those hypocrites enjoy it, it seems to be the main goal of their corporation.
@acklenheights: Ironic and tragic are probably the words I would have used, versus hilarious. Just sayin' . . .
someday when puppy mills are completely banned for their inhumane treatment of dogs this \"regional operations director\" will likely have a different tone. the fact the this person can harbor such blatent disregard for life is disturbing, to say the least.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-631841-100x100.png\")
I can totally see Chris' point. Having protesters outside his store to tell people that they get their dogs from puppy mills allows the consumer to make an informed decision. I'll bet that westie and beagle found stellar homes that day.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-322783-100x100.png\")
@unobservant: \"I'll bet that westie and beagle found stellar homes that day.\" - Because the individuals who bought them ignored picketers? I don't understand your reasoning. I'm sure the dogs picked up at shelters that day got good homes, because shelters often have some sort of a screening process, which Petland doesn't.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-351819-100x100.png\")
So what you're saying, is it's better to get dogs from a sheltar because if the sheltar gets a dog that doesn't meet standards, they'll kill it instead of finding a home for it? How Aryan of you.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-77175-100x100.png\")
@henwy: I think they are saying they have standards for the PEOPLE who are allowed to adopt, not the dogs...
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-18786-100x100.png\")
@veronykah: Wait... can I then kill the people who want puppies I have but who do not meet my standards??? AWESOME!
step away from the kb, there sport... clearly you need to ignore these topics since you can't stay calm.... and for that matter, you are talking to yourself now.
@MonkeyButt: All this sarcasm is breaking my brain. Are you responding to my post like I was being serious?
@unobservant: ohh....sorry! I was so wound up on the DRO's arrogance that I didn't recognize the sarcasm.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-759405-100x100.png\")
I bought our Boxer puppy from a Petland back around May. I never heard that they (supposedly)get their puppies from puppy mills until I saw some protesters.
Needless to say, I have a pretty sweet dog now.
@CubeRat88: Actually it's not \"needless to say\". You actually got lucky if your dog is happy and healthy now if it did actually come from a mill.
@serreca:
hmm.. (after looking up actual definition) you're right. I wonder how many times I have been using that term incorrectly?
It's hard to say about this Petland I got him from. The owner, who I have spoken to a few times, seems genuinely concerned about the animials. I could be wrong though.
@TinkishDelight officially OVER the dc tourist infestation: What? I'm just saying that he's lucky that his dog is healthy now if it came from a puppy mill, which is likely if he bought it at a Petland. I've heard horror stories about dogs bought from pet shops, getting very sick and dying soon after purchase.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-132151-100x100.png\")
@serreca: @Rectilinear Propagation: Yeah I was in agreement with you. I read his/her comment twice and still had a puzzled expression.
@TinkishDelight officially OVER the dc tourist infestation:
I'll try again <=O
I did not know, until after I bought my dog, that Petland was known for getting their puppies from puppy mills. Knowing that now, I am pretty lucky that he is a healthy dog (no kennel cough or any other weird things that most puppy mill dogs might get).
I honestly never thought about where the dogs actually came from. Call me ignorant, but like I said, I never heard of Petland getting their dogs from puppy mills until after I saw the protesters.
@CubeRat88: Do you also get the protesters point now?
You never thought about where they come from, now you have and know. Would you still choose to buy a dog from Petland KNOWING where it came from?
@TinkishDelight officially OVER the dc tourist infestation: Oops!
I think we can all agree that we care for the animals. Such as.
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-6536-100x100.png\")
@serreca: TinkishDelight was agreeing with you in that CubeRat88's conclusion didn't follow what came before it.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-470278-100x100.png\")
Saddest.Consumerist.Picture.Ever.
That is great! I think the email from Chris Beth is fantastic, and funny.
If there are specific problems, sure, bring them to light. Show documentation that the animals are kept in squalor at the store, etc.
I've gotten dogs from breeders and from shelters, and would have bought them from a brick and mortar store if the time and funds had been right any number of times.
It sounds to me like Chris Beth is handling this just fine...
@MrFalcon: And all of you who protest sweat shops using slave labor in Asia, go fuck yourself, at least I am getting my Nikes cheap. And to those of you who protested slavery, I am extremely pissed off, now that us white people have to clean our own houses.
@thrid001: Wow. If that is what you got out of what I wrote, then you're putting a heck of a lot more into this, and reading a heck of a lot more, then I ever wrote.
Maybe we could try to stay on topic?
And even make points clearly, without swearing or applying grossly inappropriate concepts to force a kneejerk reaction while illustrating points?
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-439678-100x100.png\")
@MrFalcon:
I guarantee that they have paperwork of the treacheries of puppy mills.
Also, it's not that the pet store is treating the badly (necessarily) it's that the pet store is knowingly buying their puppies from inhumane sources. It's like buying clothes from a sweatshop, only they keep the kids in cages and don't feed them.
@Comms: I don't think anyone who has commented would say that buying a dog from a puppy mill is to be put on the top ten list of things to do...
And Snowburnt - Anyone can get paperwork on the bad aspects of puppymills.
But lets look at a couple of things here: From the story, we are looking at the regional directors response to the protesters. Which I thought was great! It seems well written, it doesn't resort to name calling or superlative statements - it makes a point and has the benefit of being a bit snarky. More than fair play, especially when part of the purpose of a picket line or protesting group is to legally disrupt business. The assumption being that they can effect the bottom line of a group who is unwilling to listen to anything that doesn't effect their profit margin. Polite mutual thumbing of the nose - I dig it.
There is a responsibility to source the dogs from a reliable place. Absolutely. Can the protesters pick out which dogs come from bad sources and which come from good? I don't know - chances are pretty good they can't just from a visual inspection.
Chances are also good that if the bulk of the animals purchased are coming from bad backgrounds, there is going to be a wealth of documented problems with the animals - that stuff makes news, and change (and shut-downs) happen quickly. Plenty of \"good\" breeders supply dogs for resale - raising them in caring environments.
Yes, there are more pets in the world in shelters than have homes. Not everyone wants to rescue a dog though. Some people want puppies, some people want adult dogs, some people want to keep littermates together so they'll always feel like they have family. Those are all OK positions to have. And there are an abundance of resources available for anyone's wants to be met.
Keep in mind though, these are also all animals that are going to homes where people are caring about them. I don't know that there is a statistical difference in abandonment when you look at shelter rescues vs. breeder buys vs. brick and mortar stores. Maybe there is, I'd be interested in seeing it. But these dogs are going to homes. There can be health complications with ANY dog, of ANY breed. If it is important enough for you to do the research on, then you'll probably be part of the group that really gets to personally know the breeders. Or, maybe you just want a dog to bring into your family. Regardless, if dogs (and cats, and other animals) weren't pretty damn resilient and able to bounce back from a great deal as infants...then it wouldn't really ever make sense to rescue one, would it?
I'm all for educating the public. I'm even more for intelligent activism - where efforts are directed at making change, and not just making noise. Noise gets attention, but its often trivialized.
If there are puppy mills going on, with bad conditions (other than the fact that the animals are being bred for sales) then report them to Animal Welfare. Have the enforcing agency check them out. Set up a meeting with the sourcing managers to go over their purchasing plans - present your information to the people that can actually bring about change. You can never be penalized for posting facts, so let the public make their decisions based on that. But make your facts relevant, and not full of superlative phrases or concepts.
It is one thing to look at picket signs or posters (as an example, didn't see anything above that stated these were used) or the sample (sad!!!) picture associated with this article - but people whose minds aren't already made up are fickle. They will go inside and see what *looks* like a healthy animal to them...and go with their own judgment call.
The whole original point of all of this though...I thought his letter was great!
@MrFalcon: Soooooooooo...because puppy mills are well documented and Petland's use of them is also well documented people shouldn't make them available to people who are most likely to purchase a sick dog and perpetuate the puppy mill cycle?
it does not follow
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-171272-100x100.png\")
@MrFalcon: Reputable breeders will always take their dogs back if they cannot stay in their purchaser's home. Reputable rescues will always take their dogs back if the adoption does not work out.
Dogs in shelters (owner turn ins, at least), the vast majority of them, are dogs that were \"accidental\" litters, gotten for free, bought from a backyard breeder, or purchased from a pet store. The rescue I work with gets dogs all. the. time. from people who bought a dog with no understanding of the breed or the care needs of the animal.
Keep in mind, if you buy a puppy from a pet store, the only breeders that will provide dogs to them are mills. Reputable breeders do not provide puppies to these places. And your money, spent on one of these dogs, most likely goes to support the mill that keeps the breeding parents in cages where they have never touched grass, cannot turn around, and never have any loving human contact.
Sure, you can choose to shop there if you want. But know what your money is supporting.
@MrFalcon: Agreed! Chris is awesome. What, you people think it's OK for protesters to make these allegations against his store, but he's not allowed to respond at all? And when he taunts them, like they've been taunting him, it's somehow wrong? I'm all in favor of what he did.
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-665956-100x100.png\")
Add me to the pro-Chris list. You can protest something all you want, but I'll be damned if someone is going to tell me where to purchase something from. There's a line between wanting to educate people about bad corporate practices and actually wanting to put a company out of business.
@tbax929: Seriously. If I want a sick, overpriced dog from a puppy mill, that's my god-given right, and I'll thank those hippies for not throwing it back in my face.
@tbax929:
Solution A) Prove to protesters and the world that you have reputable sources for your puppies. (note: documentation and certification for each puppy is proof, not a binder with guidelines)
Solution B) Send off snarky email to head of protesters.
The protesters aren't looking to put them out of business, they're looking to put immoral inhumane puppy mills out of business.
Your approach is like me proving to you that soylent green is people and then you yelling \"F U!\" and chowing down in front of me.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-144398-100x100.png\")
@snowburnt: Go Chris. Screw these protesters.
I believe the law in America is innocent until proven guilty. PetLand shouldn't have to prove anything. It'd be like me saying to you, prove to me you don't beat your wife.
I'd like to see some proof from these protesters that petland get their puppys from a mills. Or did they just read about it on someone's blog and decide it would make a nice weekend activity.
@darkjedi26:
They've been proven guilty. They've been proven guilty repeatedly.
quoted from a poster on the next page:
\"The Humane Society of the US found, after an 8-month investigation, that Petland used puppy mills. Go to www.stoppuppymills.org for more info.\"
you probably support disclaimers in science books calling evolution a \"theory\"
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-184636-100x100.png\")
@darkjedi26: Are all of you forgetting the Consumerist article weeks ago where they revealed that *gasp* Petland sources their dogs from mills?
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-274367-100x100.png\")
@tbax929: And from what in any of this has led you to believe that the protesters want to put Petland out of business? People seem to jump to all kinds of conclusions just because they have a weird knee-jerk antipathy towards people who want animals to be treated humanely.
@tbax929: so, you equate the use of inhumane treatment of life, for profit no less, to a bad corporate practice? i bet you also buy your child's formula from china because you'll be damned if some bleeding heart liberal is going tell you where you can and cannot purchase things, right? perhaps if you educated yourself, even slightly, on this issue you might have a different attitude. unless you derive some sort of satisfaction in unnecessary suffering.
Is this particular franchisee in the tenth grade or what?
+1 petland
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-19238-100x100.png\")
Oh ben, I love it when you include a wikipedia reference. It's always nice to learn something new
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-104054-100x100.png\")
this wasn't from the franchisee, but the Director of Regional Operations.
My wife is friends with many of these protesters, this is great. They have many stories from people that purchased puppies from this Petland that had massive health problems and things found from shut down puppie mills that indicate Petland's use of them.
It's really sad. But it's a simple fix that could do correct this, but it will eat into their profits...
Thanks for posting this.
The protestors are obviously negatively effecting their business or Christopher Beth would not have taken the time to contact them. Those that are high-fiving Petland are missing the point. This exchange is embarassingly ridiculous. There is a reason why corporations hire lawyers and/or pr firms to speak for them.
@TinkishDelight officially OVER the dc tourist infestation: Completely untrue. By talking to them Beth knows they will just protest more. If he wanted less protesting he would have ignored it. Remember there is no such thing as bad publicity. These protesters are drawing attention to his store. He is playing them like a fiddle.
@Corporate_guy: If they actually were drawing in business he obviously wouldn't tell them because that's the opposite of their intention. It would cause them to stop. That was the purpose of the email, to confuse them into thinking they are helping him instead of hurting.
Really, I feel like Will Ferrell's character in Zoolander explaining this to you. \"Am I taking crazy pills?! They're all the same look!\"
@TinkishDelight officially OVER the dc tourist infestation: Trust me no one is every dissuaded by protesters. The people who support the cause already avoid the store, but the people who think the protesters are nutty(mostly everyone) will choose to shop there. There was a grocery store that was non-union where I used to live. They were picketed for over a year before the union finally figured out no one cared about their protest and gave up. I went out of my way to shop there because the protest allowed me to know they were non-union.
@Corporate_guy: maybe I just feel this way because I despise puppy mills, but I feel like this is different. Only a true sicko would knowingly buy a puppy from petland if it is advertised to you that the puppy you are buying was beaten, starved, mistreated and overpriced.
it would be like buying a car from GM.
@snowburnt: I am not sure about over priced. I would imagine operations like petland do what they do to make it cheaper. Otherwise there would already be no reason to buy an animal from them.
I agree completely. Maybe some of the people posting here are as delusional as the protesters but I'll bet money no one who was going to Petland saw the protesters and because of them turned around and went home.
There are always crazy wankers protesting something or other. If it's not those PETA nutjobs handing out buckets of blood outside a KFC, it's some other branch of concern troll. If people really were so spineless as to avoid any buisness being protested, they would be shutins.
@TinkishDelight officially OVER the dc tourist infestation: Unless he's doing a double-blind, and actually does want them to keep showing up. If he ignores them, their numbers will slowly dwindle as the less-motivated protesters lose interest. By sending snarky-sounding emails, he motivates them.
Not very likely, but if their sales actually did go up during the protest, it's semi-plausible.
@Corporate_guy: What? If it wasn't effecting his business he would ignore it because he wouldn't care. If he wanted attention he would not have sent one protestor a private email. It's one thing to have protestors against dirty language, it's completely another to have protestors against the health of the animal you're about to adopt. There is no good spin for that.
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-793795-100x100.png\")
I wonder how credible is the humane society now days. We have a local shelter here run by the county the conditions were very bad. My daughter called the local news and humane society a few years back and they were of no help and did not even try to do anything. Her complaints to the county feel on deaf ears. Eventually enough citizens complained they cleaned it up some. I guess if their claims are valid its good to see people take some action and get involved. It seems that the real culprit is the main corporation and not the franchises.
It's all relative. Hell, PETA took thousands of animals from sheltars which were caring for them and slaughtered them in their own little holocaust van. After they were done, they pitched them into dumpsters. This is coming from an organization who claims to care for animal welfare. Besides being massive hypocrites, they're also just par for the course.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-178542-100x100.png\")
@frodolives35: The Humane Society is mostly funded by taxpayer dollars. As in, your county or city determines its budget. I know the HS in my hometown just got its budget slashed. It's not a \"for profit\" enterprise, but rather one intended to keep cities and towns from being overrun by stray & diseased animals.
If someone is concerned about the conditions there, and the appropriate officials won't answer to the allegations, she should A.) Volunteer or B.) Donate money.
@catastrophe: If you are reffering to Humane Society of the United States, they get NO tax money. [www.hsus.org] See line 1D.
In fact most Humane Societies (not HSUS) and SPCAs (not ASPCA) are non-profits that are not funded with tax money, but private donations.
Animal Care and Control services are tax payer funded. Your local HS deserves your support and time.
And HSUS and ASPCA is a very biased and left wing political group along the same lines as PETA. They have no shelters or adoption centers and do not directly care for any animals. I would never give them a dime. They are purely political and do not have animals interests at heart.
That was outstandingly unprofessional. Either deny the allegations of puppy mill connections, or ignore the protestors (if you are evil.)
By the way, our 1 y.o. Catahoula hound mix we got at the local animal control last week is doing great. She likes to chase sticks and helped keep me and my wife warm in our tent when we went camping this weekend.
@opsomath: Yay about your new dog. :)
We got our Corgi mix from the shelter almost two years ago and she is nearly perfect. A bit whiny, but only because she loves us, right? Right? Anyway, I talk up adopting from shelters whenever anyone mentions getting a pet. Our two cats also came from a shelter and we are a happy little family.
The equivalent of the Kimberly Process for breeders of AKC certification of blood lines and the fairly tight knit community of reputable purebred dog breeders.
If you want a purebred dog, find a breeder and work with them. If you think that's too expensive, or somehow it offends your sensibilities, get a mutt from the pound.
Pet Stores offer dog buyers two forms of value (neither of which are worth the middle-man mark-up):
a) the offer the ease of one-stop shopping -- which if you're dropping $500-$1500 on a decidedly high maintenance puppy, probably shouldn't be high on your list of criteria; and
b) they buffer you from dog breeders, which appear (in the aggregate) to be full-on crazy people. I can only speak from personal experience, but the better the blood lines in the dogs, the more likely the breeder is going to act straight out of \"Best in Show'. As long as you understand that going into the deal, you'll be fine.
@ndonahue: There are also plenty of purebreds as well as designer mutts like labradoodles in the pounds.
@Ratty: True story. I have a bull terrier and have worked with bull terrier rescue...all the dogs I've pulled including my own have been in city run shelters.
@ndonahue: The value you speak of is pretty amusing. You talk about breeders with dogs with the better blood lines being \"full-on crazy\". If you put as much time and effort to breed top quality dogs wouldn't you be a bit \"crazy\" about who you sold a puppy to? Considering the caliber of a lot of pet owners I, for one, would be SUPER crazy about who got one of my puppies.
After working for rescue, I see what happens to the dogs that are ordered off the internet or bought from pet stores. The person usually knows NOTHING about the breed, thinks they are \"cute\", doesn't know the first thing about dog ownership and doesn't care. In the case of bull terriers, the end up being WAY more dog than the person can handle and they drop them off at the shelter at about 1 year old and in the case of my dog state they \"wanted to get a different dog\" as the reason.
A reputible breeder probably turns people like the above down, said person decides the breeder is \"crazy\" and doesn't know what they are talking about, goes to Petland and gets the dog anyway.
Its ridiculous and sad.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-64511-100x100.png\")
What does Petland do with dogs that don't sell? I'm genuinely curious. Are they euthanized?
@wallapuctus: /apologizes in advance/
Soylent Blue. Soylent Green is people.
More seriously: I don't know. Even if they send them to the shelter, most shelters euthanize in the long run. In my area only about 30% of shelter animals are adopted. And despite the intended facetiousness (facetiety?) of my comment above, it could be a lot less humane than euthanasia. I'd hate to think what happens if they get sold offshore.
That email exchange was on the mild side of mild. Why is this even news? Who cares if an employee of a store people are picketing isn't 100% professional in his dealings with the protestors? Why should he be?
@ilves: Take a look at his title. He's not an employee of a store. He is the Director of Regional Operations of Petland, Inc. He should be professional because he IS a professional -- moreover he is representing not just that particular store but the company that owns those stores.
@ilves: He's not an employee of the store, he's the Regional Director of Operations. His attitude speaks to the larger attitude of the company, in that they don't really care about animals, just turning a profit any way possible. Blech.
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-537475-100x100.png\")
I hate puppy mills, and I think the most effective kinds of protests are always peaceful and rational ones. I'm not going to listen to you if you're screaming in my face, and if I happen to walk into a Petland (I don't have any near me, and I wouldn't anyway) I don't want people shouting after me that I'm killing innocent puppies. But I wouldn't be upset if protesters were to hand out fliers with some kind of evidence (not just claims, but a report from any agency, or the Humane Society, or even a newspaper article) to suggest that their uproar isn't just hot air.
@pecan pi: Actually effective protest means you should be uncomfortable. Why do you think furs are not high fashion anymore.
@thrid001:
You obviously haven't been paying attention. Fur sales are up. I could only find hard numbers for around a decade up to 2000, but the trend has continued:
1991 : $1.0 billion
1992 : $1.1 billion
1993 : $1.2 billion
1994 : $1.1 billion
1995 : $1.2 billion
1996 : $1.25 billion
1997 : $1.27 billion
1998 : $1.21 billion
1999 : $1.40 billion
2000 : $1.69 billion
I went to a petland when i was shopping for dogs a year ago. The one I went to had to talk to a breeder and get back to me with a price. They quoted me $1200 for one Siberian Husky puppy. Granted it had its shots and everything but still. They're absurdly over priced. I ended up going to a local breeder and got two wonderful huskies, the first for $400 and the second for $350 (return discount). The breeder said that she and her family barely break even with the puppies they sell and just do it because they like having puppies around.
Don't buy dogs from pet stores. Go to the SPCA or a breeder who cares about the dogs. (I just got out of college and have always wanted huskies. This is the only reason we didn't adopt.)
@Necoras: You can always adopt from breed specific rescue places as well, you don't have to adopt just from a pound.
@TacoChuck: You can also adopt from the pound...surely there are no shortages of huskies.
[www.petfinder.com]
[www.siberianrescue.com]
@veronykah: Very true, but we have two cats. Huskies don't get along well with cats if they aren't socialized very young. We got our two as puppies and they get along great.
@darkjedi26 $1000 is reasonable if you're paying for cross country shipping, or want a show dog.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-469220-100x100.png\")
Have to agree with Petland here. There are few things lower on the totem pole than bottom feeding sucking eating protesters. The bums lost, your revolution is over, do what your parents did and get a job.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-68204-100x100.png\")
@HIV 2 Elway Resurrected: sarcasm just doesn't translate well... but well played Mr. Lebowski, well played...
@HIV 2 Elway Resurrected: The thing I don't get is where is their proof? Everyone in comments is assuming that the protestors are right. But there really isn't any proof. I'd be kind of irritated if I was Petland too.
@Sean Tapscott: www.stoppuppymills.com
just because you've never been to the bottom of the ocean doesn't make it bottomless
@Sean Tapscott: Well clearly if you are protesting, you have to be right. Because people with a picket sign can never be wrong...right? right?...
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-15811-100x100.png\")
\"There are few things lower on the totem pole than bottom feeding sucking eating protesters.\"
Yeah, I'm just thinking about those idiot civil rights protesters back in the 1960s. What the hell did they accomplish anyway?
@HIV 2 Elway Resurrected: Very clever Mr. Lebowski.
I'm not exactly sure how you could classify protesters as bottom feeders since I'm pretty sure all the get out of it is self-satisfaction.
Also, while most of the time protesting something is probably one of the worst ways of getting something changed, depending on the way the message is being delivered and the circumstances of the protest, a lot can be accomplished.
To be honest, if the vast majority of dogs from pet stores had problems, people wouldn't buy dogs from pet stores.
I'm sure the protesters have lots and lots of stories of dogs with behavioral problems, genetic problems, physical problems, etc that were from puppy mills. How many puppies from breeders have those issues?
An honest breeder would say \"a few.\"
If they're protesting about puppy mills, they should get the health inspectors in Texas to go inspect the mills, or try proposing some legislation. But store protests are really a waste of time.
First:
The Humane Society of the US found, after an 8-month investigation, that Petland used puppy mills. Go to www.stoppuppymills.org for more info.
Second:
My wife and I ran a Boxer rescue organization in Missouri, heart of puppy mill country, and saw more heartbreak than I care to remember.
Petland makes plenty of money from the petfood and supplies side of their stores. These protesters aren't trying to run them out of business, they're trying to get them out of the puppy mill support business.
If you want a pet, try the shelter or buy from a reputable breeder. And spay or neuter, please.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-745137-100x100.png\")
@slinky22: Wanna talk \"puppy mill country\" you should have to live in PA near Lancaster. PA's famous for the Liberty Bell and Puppy Mills...we should have that on our licence plates.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-92154-100x100.png\")
not at all as douchey as i expected from the headline, sounds like he's just having a bit of good-natured jabbing without descending into calling names or anything...
To me, there is a difference between saying \"I don't care what you do because we're in the right\" (like Domino's reaction to the C&D letter) and saying \"I don't care what you do because we're making money\" which is what the Director of Regional Operations is saying.
Some people will infer from this that they do not care if the puppies are mistreated. That might not be fair (especially since they don't argue the point in the e-mails at all) but they'll apply the Director's \"I don't care\" snark to the puppy mill issue.
A store employee or manager could get away with this kind of e-mail exchange but someone this high up should know to be more careful about what they say.
Upset about puppy mill use by Petland, or just by the nonchalant way this exec ignores the charges? Go here:
It's useless arguing with troll here, but enough interested people can make a difference, given enough PR.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-24620-100x100.png\")
Chris Beth has proved that he is a total retard, and I'll bet he has and MBA and makes 6 figures. Can I have his job? I don't have to be told that anything you put in writing can and will end up on the Internet.
I'm no fan of the puppy mill thing, but the real problem is the idiots who still insist on buying purebred dogs rather than adopting. Don't buy - market dries up - puppy mills close.
BTW, I found two of the best dogs I've ever known abandoned on the side of a road on a wet, freezing day, covered in mange and excrement, and almost dead from exposure. They had been puppy mill puppies: one was obviously a runt, the other had supernumerary dew claws. I originally intended to nurse them back to health and then find homes for them. Within a week, they changed my mind because of their even dispositions and high intelligence. Eight years later, they're big, gorgeous, healthy, sweet-tempered, and scary smart. In addition, I have a 17 year old Airdale mix that my husband adopted from the pound before we met who is a \"dumb blonde\" ;o) but a real sweetheart, and a cat I adopted last August - she had been in our local shelter for five of her seven years! - and is also very sweet tempered and intelligent. I never had a bit of trouble getting this blended family to blend, either - they've watch out for each other and even formed a pack bond with the cat!
@Keter:
No, the real problem is not the fact that some people want purebred dogs. Not all purebred dogs come from puppy mills. There are many good and reputable breeders in this country. Breeders that don't keep their dogs in tiny cages, breeders that only breed healthy dogs, breeders who do background checks and will accept dogs back if it doesn't work out with the owner. There's absolutely nothing in the world that's wrong with buying a purebred puppy over a mutt with an unknown background from the shelter. The only problem is with the source of that dog or puppy.
I both laugh at and am disgusted with the people in the comments who say there's no proof. There's no reputable breeder on the planet who will sell to a pet shop. Any dog or cat or rodent at a pet shop is from a mill or backyard breeder who shouldn't be supported.
Any person who buys any dog (or cat) from a pet shop should be ashamed of themselves if they're aware of their sources for animals (not that ignorance is much of an excuse, animal ownership should require research). Rodents and birds shouldn't be purchased from pet stores either, only shelters or reputable breeders.
@jameleon: While I don't believe that the people everyone here keeps referring to as \"reputable breeders\" are mean or evil or have anything but love for the animals they work with, I think you may have missed Keter's point.
No, the real problem is not the fact that some people want purebred dogs. Not all purebred dogs come from puppy mills.
Regardless of the quality of the conditions in which the animals are produced, the unavoidable parallel is that both promote reproduction of animals for sale purposes.
There are far too many homeless animals in shelters for me to consider breeders \"reputable\" in a larger sense. Generally nice people and trustworthy among those wanting purebred dogs, maybe. But the very fact that they're encouraging more puppies into the world knocks a bit of the shine off of their reputations in my view.
Then there's the whole issue of limited gene pools and breed-specific health problems, which exist in the first place because some dumbass humans decided they could really use more of this kind of dog for hunting or that kind of dog for racing, and could they maybe add in the traits from that dog that barks less or has shorter legs? Feh.
Go to the goddamn shelters, people. And tell anyone you know who is considering becoming a breeder...just, don't.
Reputable breeders do not sell to stores. period. They screen homes themselves. Regardless of if it is a mill or a BYB looking to make a buck, a dog sold at a pet store is not coming from a good environment.
The exceptions are dogs being adopted out by shelters in stores, like petco or PetSmart. Petland needs to get with the times and stop supporting this.
And for everyone wondering where the protester proof is: [consumerist.com]
I think I'll avoid petland in the future. Anybody know where I can get a puppy? Not too young. Housebroken. Friendly. Good with cats, kids.
@SwahaCrane: The above suggestions are good - you might also try rescue groups if you're looking for a specific breed. Please, please consider adoption, there are so many animals in need of rescue.
SwahaCrane
I highly recommend going to www.petfinder.com to look for a shelter close to you. Often shelters can help you with the type of dog you're looking for, mutt or pure-bred. I have a pure bred labrador retriever that I got from a no-kill shelter, and we love her to death. You'd be amazed at all the different breeds of puppies you can find at shelters.
Generally speaking, \"in your face\" protesting is annoying and inneffective.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-18124-100x100.png\")
Screw it. You won't reach these people, you might as well be a wiseass and have fun.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-438422-100x100.png\")
I think people forget about the invisible hand of capitalism... competition. If the public thinks that puppy mills and petland are in the wrong, no one will do business with them. We can't restrict businesses from doing anything that protesters don't like. I don't like it either, but I just won't buy a puppy there.
Before you know it, there will be protesters protesting the protesters. But protest away, we need people from both sides in order to be informed.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-435267-100x100.png\")
AKC and UKC papers prove nothing. Anyone that can sign a check can get papers for their dog. No reputable breeder sells to chain stores. Period. Reputable breeders sign contracts with individuals that include right of first refusal if the customer ever changes his/her mind, no questions asked. They also check up on their puppies after they are placed in a home.
Petland (and other chain stores that sell dogs and cats) is well known in animal welfare circles (NOT animal rights like PETA - different thing entirely) for dealing with huge puppy millers like Harte.
Large \"industrial-type\" pupply mills care little about the genetics or health of the animals supplied to the stores. They just want the \"merchandise\" out the door. And, yes, unsold or ill animals are put down. This has been extensively documented by present and former employees and needs no amplification here. Many dogs with genetic problems surface well after the fact - when it's too late. These dogs would never have been bred by a responsible breeder that knew their breed's genetic background. These operations are primarily responsible for the proliferation of genetically-carried problems like hip dysplasia and poor temperament in many breeds.
I am a volunteer for an organization that rescues dogs - many with health problems that are the direct result of poor breeding practices on the part of millers. I try to help undo some of the damage these huge companies are causing to my favorite breeds. I don't bother protesting at stores. It's a waste of my time. I try to heal the sick ones, the unwanted ones, the abandoned ones, the pets that were bought on impulse from places like Petland.
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-143317-100x100.png\")
Who signs a letter completely unrelated to medical issues with their M.D. title at the end of their name?
A Douchebag.
Is that supposed to impress anyone?
Here's some new information about Petland. A store manager apparently allowed one of his dogs to freeze to death in his back yard. So much for those humane care guidelines.
http://hsus.typepad.com/wayne/2009/01/petland-investigation.html
Just curious, to the posters saying \"how do the protesters know they got the dogs from puppy mills?\"
Where exactly do you think these puppies came from then?
@veronykah: May we hope you get empaneled on a jury against us.
\"The defense has failed to prove how the victim died; therefore the defendant is guilty.
There should be like a service where you get to abuse the people that abuse animals. Cause that sounds like a great and rewarding field of work.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-724321-100x100.png\")
I hope that people start paying more attention to where their dogs come from, but then again you can never underestimate the idiocy of spontaneous consumers. That's why I'm all for shutting down \"mall\" pet stores that dish out puppy-milled dogs to people with zero responsibility.
The sad part is that these people will wind up paying big $$$ at the vet when their pet comes down with some easily avoidable genetic condition, something a breeder would work to eliminate.
Tragic.
Yeah, I gotta say I like the email. I would never buy a dog from a store like that, but there are some people that just don't/won't do the research for it. Those folks end up at Petland/Petco.
From a simple wise consumer point of view, buying a puppy from a pet store is flat out the riskiest and most expensive way to get a dog. The commenter above who mentioned a quote of $1200 from a pet store for a siberian husky: that is the exactly the kind of ridiculousness I'm talking about.
I have relatives who for many years have been among the top three breeders of bullmastiffs in North America. (E.g.: Their dogs have won Best of Breed at Westminster twice.) For $1000 you could get a pet-quality (as opposed to show quality) dog who still exemplified the top 1% of the breed in terms of health, temperament, and longevity. You could meet the puppy's parents (both the canine and human ones) and observe for yourself that the pup was individually cared for in a family environment. Likewise, you could pick up the phone any time and talk to someone with 25 years of experience raising dogs like yours.
Of course, none of this is to say you have to spend $1000 to get a great dog. But, if you are prepared to spend that much, for Dog's sake get a pup from a respected family breeder rather than dropping a grand at Petland.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-219008-100x100.png\")
Puppy suffering is not funny.
Well, seems to me that the protestors are a bit MORE than \"bitchy\". They're downright arrogant pricks. Serves them right to get bitch-slapped right back. Maybe if they found something to do with their OWN lives instead of trying to control everyone else's, the world would be a better place.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-61931-100x100.png\")
I live not too far from that store. We buy a lot of supplies for our pets (5 cats, 6 birds, 2 sugar gliders) from Petland, but that ends tonight. I'm glad Mr. Beth let us know his company's contempt for people who are concerned about animal welfare. I'm sure he wouldn't want to accept money from someone like me so I'll relieve him of the burden.
I'll be e-mailing him to let him know this. I'm sure he'll be pleased.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-246513-100x100.png\")
Think adoption! Respect to Dr Pippin for spending time every Saturday to alert the public. Not only are the dogs in danger when you encourage puppy mills, but so is your wallet. Hip problems, malformed organs, high risk of cancer. Your vet will be pleased and you and your puppy mill dog will be miserable.
interesting that you mention the kimberley process, considering what a sham it is.
You would ask that the puppy mills be responsible for policing themselves? If they could do that, there wouldn't be problems in the first place.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-793925-100x100.png\")
Is this Petland different than the one that is in the NYC area?
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-25155-100x100.png\")
Puppy mills!? I've never even heard of that. How perverse... Treating cows like crap is one thing. We know their fate. But a puppy is going to become a companion. Talk about stacking the deck.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-82119-100x100.png\")
Personally, I feel good in knowing I got my dog from a respectable private breeder and not some pet store chain.
Just to add to the satisfied theme (experientially, morally, emotionally), my past companion and my present one were rescues from the Humane Soc.
Rottie/Shepherd/Lab cross, sweethearts both, and the delight of my neighbourhood.
Present Dottie, age five, 110 lean pounds, has a particular street where she is allowed off-leash (shhh!)during our urban walks. One day we coincided with the presence of two young (7 and 5) girls on their front lawn. Dottie ambled over, taking them by surprise. Immediately she rolled over for a passive tummy-rub, allaying any fears in the kids, who first tentatively stroked her underfur.
I checked with Dad who ws mowing the lawn, that this interaction was persmissable: he watched, then grinned (he had seen us in previous pass-bys).
I called to Dots and had her heel, and stay. I went over to the oldest kid and whispered in her ear \"this is Dottie. Tell her to \"come, sit!, say it real strong.\"
She did. Dots did.
- The look on the child's face was that of a magic moment: a beast almost twice her size was under her thrall!
Not forgetting Junior, I whispered to this tiny person: say \"Dottie, lie down!\"
She did, and she did.
The sisters were ecstatic; Dots was pleased at interacting with new people. Dad had shut off the mower to watch this go.
Such is the trust that Dots (and previous Doris) radiate: it's like an aura, despite their size and doggie-teeth. Doris and now Dots just drew people in. Even passers-by would comment \"what a sweet puppy!\" (110 lbs?) and \"can I pet her/him?\" etc.
On that note, I want to put in a good word for Rottweilers. In Britain they are called \"Nanny dogs\". Compare with their reputation across the pond, here.
And factor in my Rottie-heavy mutts that have delighted me and my community for more than ten years.
Which joined me as \"rescues\". _Happy me, happy doggies. Happy people we meet!
What a deal.
That profit is so much more important than the health and safety of living, breathing animals... *growls*
*wibble* Puppy...
If the store is, in fact, a franchise and the regional operations manager obviously could care less, this is one of those situations where perhaps contacting *other* Petland stores and threatening a boycott might prove very effective.
In the current economic climate, anything that potentially harms business -- particularly if the other franchises aren't selling mill pullies and feel they'll get caught in the crossfire -- is going to encourage the franchisees to take action, and the corporate office *will* listen to them.
from [www.chillicotheohio.com]
PETLAND ADDS TO STAFF: The corporate headquarters of Petland has added Christopher Beth as a business improvement consultant and Ed McDonie as a merchandiser for franchised stores in the nation. Beth assists new franchises and provides employee training. He counsels franchises on operational concerns in Arizona, Nevada and Texas. McDonie is responsible for merchandising both new and existing stores.
I'm thinking petland might want to rethink Mr. Best's qualifications as a business improvement consultant.
Yes there is a \"Kimberly Process\" coming. National Mill Dog Rescue, a group dedicated to ending the puppy mill industry through consumer education (www.milldogrescue.org) is currently formulating a \"Compassion Certification\" program. This will be a rigorous voluntary inspection program for responsible breeders. Tell everyone you know to start looking for it!
RE: the \"Kimberly Process for Dogs\" comments...people should also be aware that there are several groups that sell \"certification\" papers to puppy mill breeders to give an air of respectability to the mills.
Buy from a reputable breeder or, better yet, adopt.
41 years, eh? Longevity is a sure thing measuring stick?
Lehman Bros: 162 years
Circuit City: 49 Years
Linens & Things: 33 Years
General Motors: 100 Years
Best of luck to you and your longevity, Chris!
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-259770-100x100.png\")
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-42681-100x100.png\")
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-90073-100x100.png\")
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-264697-100x100.png\")
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-159466-100x100.png\")
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-308077-100x100.png\")
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-219805-100x100.png\")
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-68449-100x100.png\")
Hey chris - Does your mother know she raised such a douche bag? I dont know if i should feel bad for her or be angry at her.
@bobloblawsblog: She probably does.
@bobloblawsblog: I guess you've done the research to actually see if the store in question truly is using puppy mills? I know I was bitched at by several people by telling them I bought a puppy from a store and was immediately condemned as approving of puppy mills until I shoved the the legitimate stamped and signed breeders papers in their faces that it came from and told them to \"STFU.\"
Honestly, find a better hobby or get proof.
@bobloblawsblog:
Sounds like a great response to me. It's always a good idea to ridicule these spastic protesters. If you don't, they actually start to take themselves seriously.