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This is giving them so much free advertiesing. I wish it would just go away.
This is giving them so much free advertiesing. I wish it would just go away.
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Here's hoping, if only because I have so many more pictures of this crazy car to use.
I'm waiting for Ford to revoke their franchise license.
By the grace of God.
gee, if only Ford would likewise force their dealerships to do business in an ethical manner.
Fuck Ford. They can go to hell.
I would think that the ad was much more offensive to non-Christian theists than it was to atheists with their \"86% believe in God. Since we now know 86% are Christians...\" nonsense.
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Zzzzz.....
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This is just insane. Ford should really take some action after this one, considering that this dealership basically said, \"Well, Ford HQ made us apologize...but we didn't really mean it, because we're right and they're wrong.\"
This dealership also doesn't quite realize the power that the blogosphere can yield. Certainly, the Consumerist entity itself gets many a thing done, but when you combine them with so many other outlets picking up this story? This dealership is going to get its license revoked sooner or later for their proselytizing (and xenophobia, bigotry, etc.) under the Ford banner.
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-429538-100x100.png\")
I can't help but wonder: if you were to buy a car from them, and they were to find that you're not Christian, what happens then? Do you suddenly not get the same level of service (e.g. warranty, tune-ups) that regular Christians would get?
I could imagine people who have had problems with the dealer before, hearing that they're shunning the non-believers (shun, shun!), can probably have a case now that they've made this public. They've made their bias known, and those who've had problems and weren't of the religious persuasion could have a leg to stand on.
I know these guys, bought a couple of trucks from them and work out in Mojave. Good guys, and are not your average sales monkeys. They have loyal customers and won't be affected by this.
Seems to me that a lot of people are just looking for things to be angry about. If you dont like it, don't buy from there. Like they said, sit down and shut up =(
This media discussion keeps revolving around atheists. There are plenty of people with other religious leanings and other Christians who found the ad massively offensive. The dealership keeps trying to claim it is those darn atheists causing all the trouble. That is what rolls around in the brains of people like Kern and Horne. It feeds into their desire for some sort of civil war against \"those darn eeevil atheists. I would love to see the media ask them what they thought when other Christians or people of other faiths find their tactics and statements offensive.
Ford needs to pull their licensee. This is as bad for Ford's name as a dealership doing fraudulent repairs or selling used cars while hiding flood damage or cars patched together from two different cars.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-270939-100x100.png\")
These guys are off their rocker if they think their god even wants them to parade around with this holier than thou attitude. People like these give christians a bad rap as a bunch of bible thumpers. I use to do door to door in home demonstrations and the biggest nut job whackos I ever came across were christians. They home school (brainwash) their children despite not having an adequate education themselves, and get away with it because they do it in the name of god. But yet when people overseas do those things in the name of allah, it's war time.
@Preyfar: I was wondering the same thing. What if a customer comes in wearing a yarmulke, turban or a hijab? What if two women or two men come in to purchase a car together? How do they get treated versus someone who has a crucifix on a chain around their neck?
Of course, religion and sexual orientation are not so apparent on everyone, but you have to wonder how they treat those individuals for which they ARE apparent and don't share the dealership's ideology.
@edicius: I wonder if Horne's screed on his blog and Kieffe's total support of Horne's actions means that Kieffe Ford is racist too? Horne made a reply to comments in his blog where he went on a really out there tantrum about Mexicans. So what if someone who is a US resident, yet Mexican decent went in there to buy a car? Will they too get crappy treatment? If Kieffe has this issue with anyone his wacky version of religion doesn't approve of what about someone who they perceive to be gay tries to shop there? Hmm
@Rippleeffect: If you don't like people being angry about stuff, don't come here. Like they said, sit down and shut up. Troll.
It's sad to say but he probably got a boost in business over all this publicity. There are a lot of ignorant people who feel the same way as this douche, and went to go buy 5 cars just to support his cause.
@Rippleeffect: yeah you have no friends or followers and your account was started this month. Nice try guys, but it's easy to spot a coward. We know it's you kieffe. don't be a coward just admit it's you.
@ALL COMMENTERS: Lets all e-mail the editors to noticy them of the corporate drones that are from kieffe are active commenters on the name 'rippleeffect' so that way they get banned!
*notify
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This is what a shop does that has neither quality, nor service, nor ethics. If their ONLY selling point is that they're Christianist bigots, then they'll go down in flames soon enough.
Why do I say this? Because what dealership can compete against other dealerships by staying honest? These people can't... they don't have the brains. The more they scream and whine that they're lily-white Christians, the more their inevitable scams and customer mistreatment will stand out.
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Classy.
@Alex Chasick: So do you own a banhammer? I think Chris told me once that only Ben has the power to ban people.
@edicius: Indeed. I can put on a crucifix. Anyone can. I can \"give God the glory\" in my speech (there's a secretary in my office who is borderline obnoxious about it). Anyone can learn the patter. I probably know more actual Bible verses and theology than these stupid dealers do. If they were by some incredible chance the last dealers on Earth, I could still avoid getting ripped off, just by putting up a fake front.
It's easy. Most Christians do it every day as a matter of course.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-7387-100x100.png\")
Okay, then. I retract my comment in the apology entry.
However, I will stand by my belief that being a Ford dealer and living in Bakersfield is punishment enough for this tool.
wow children. I've not started an account until now because I never felt I had something to say, even though I've read this blog since last year. You people are paranoid. All this anger over a commercial not anywhere near you, not directed to you, and a person signs up to give some local info, and you bite his damn head off.
imo, this was a smart advertising move considering the local people here. Mostly Christian, conservative, and republican, and they mostly advertise on the local country station (typically more christian listeners than other genres) I can't really see that people locally were offended.
The more you get angry over it, the more publicity they receive.
Just saying I know these guys, and all the bitching here isn't going to change them, which is more than I can say for people that only try to please you at the cost of their own beliefs.
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I'm pretty sure Jesus would drive a Prius, not a Ford.
No, I just coincidentally have the same bear. I feel very ashamed, like we showed up to the same party wearing the same dress, but I'm just too lazy to change it and too ashamed to go naked.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-91238-100x100.png\")
is it just me or does Blog-lo-dites sound like some defunct ice cream from the 80s?
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-307161-100x100.png\")
I can't believe their websites survived the traffic. Why is it the slashdot effect (Consumerist effect?) only applies to good sites?
this whole \"Christian\" car dealership thing just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. what the hell does selling cars have anything to do with religion?
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-188304-100x100.png\")
@NoNamesLeft: I know people say any press helps a company out whether good or bad but I would hope in a state as open minded as CA that something like this would only cause them to lose customers.
@pine22: I'm not sure, though there's a similar trend in real estate agencies to broadcast their identity as well. I think the idea is that like-minded people will believe that a Christian dealer/agent is going to be more honest and fair. Having my own beliefs solidified by first-hand experience, the last person I'd trust with anything is an outspoken Christian with a faux persecution complex.
I think that RippleEffect has a point, if they're trying to capture a demographic then this is a good way to go. It's a really blunt way of saying that \"we're too cool for everyone else but you're special.\"
It's the same principle as the Mac vs. PC ads, just that those were funny in a different way.
It's stupid and offensive to people outside of that group, but that's the point. It's up to Ford to decide whether or not they want their brand associated with that kind of intolerance at this point.
It's people like this who give the rest of us religious people a bad name. Incidents of ignorance laced with the lack of tact or respect only serve to fuel the stereotype that people who believe in God or people who call themselves Christian are ignorant and disrespect the beliefs of others.
It just makes me sad.
@parad0x360: Open-minded California is a myth. Though we have some pockets of progressives, the state as a whole is moderately conservative. However, the further south and inland you go, the more conservative it gets. The inland counties (where this Ford dealer is located) can be very Bible Belt-like in their religious views.
However, California's demographics and economy are changing quickly, so I think it's just a question of time before his own ads or failure to adapt to a changing marketplace put him out of business.
@DaveStolte: I bet he would love that. He would probably get alot of money from Ford in a lawsiut if they did.
Private business gets its license revoked by Ford, over religious advertising. It would really get headlines.
@dantsea: You sir are correct. The \"Left Coast\" really only applies to the first 30-50 miles from the coast. From experience (living here 25 years) the more inland you go, the more bible belt it becomes.
people need to let ford inc know of their feelings on this...
maybe this \"person\" that owns this dealership will be laughing just as much when ford pulls his franchise...
the big 3 are looking to cut the crap dealerships out...
another thing is to find those companies that use that dealership for business uses (ie company cars, supply their vending machines, their parts suppliers) and let them know...
maybe they wont deal with a company that acts like this....
i find it sad that when christians act this way, non christians must \"deal with it\" but when things go the other way, its \"anti-american\", maybe the christians need to \"deal with it\" when the schools ban religious expression on campus...
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I beg to differ. I'm Christian, and I will never buy a car from them. As in ever. Most Christians I know are made sick by this sort of thing.
I would remind them that to truly *be* Christian, they would need to follow the words of Christ. Especially the ones were he said that people who loudly proclaimed their own faith for gain are doing it wrong.
Matthew 6:5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites [are]: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
Jesus, for the win.
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@SonicMan: Actually I bet it's written into the contract that the license can be revoked for any reason at Ford's sole discretion, so if Ford feels that the dealer is behaving badly -- and remember that dealers have the company name and logo and are the public face of the company, so what the dealer does reflects on Ford -- they can lose their franchise, and all Ford would have to say is \"we don't have to give you a reason, we felt that this relationship should not continue\".
If you are franchising some bigger company's product, you'd better be damn sure that you are putting your best foot forward at all times, especially if that franchise is your only source of income. (I don't know if this dealer sells other makes, and I'm not going to find their website to give them any traffic).
There are lots of other dealers out there that would probably be interested in selling Fords. Or, since sales are nosediving for a bunch of reasons, the company will just decide to have one less dealership and save money.
All in all, NOT a good idea to go against what your franchisor tells you to do. Especially not now, when you need them more than they need you.
@snoop-blog: Ben, Meg, and Anne the Comments Moderator get to ban people, but the rest of us can flag people as necessary. I try not to do that unless another there are a string of personal attacks (someone went off on Bladefist a month or two ago and got banned, if you want an example), but now is as good a time as any to remind everyone that one way to lose commenter privileges is by being boring, and nothing is more boring than a \"slow news day?\" or \"why is this on consumerist?\" comment.
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All publicity is NOT good publicity (if it was, then why would Ford have demanded the apology in the first place?). And while I realize that many of us here are too lazy, apathetic, or ignorant to pay attention to an issue that goes on for more than one post, or to sustain a sense of right and wrong past 3 or 4 comments, the point here is that RELIGIOUS INTOLERANCE IS NOT OKAY in a free country, period, no matter what flavor the bigot that's doing it.
For being bigots -- for trying to divide people along an imaginary Christian/atheist line, when the truth is so much more complex and deserving of compassion -- these people deserve every inch of trouncing they get, online or off, in or out of the business realm.
The \"sit down and shut up\" people, whom I applaud for attempting to use a slogan from third grade to win a grown-up discussion, need to realize that it is NOT a mandate of tolerance to be \"tolerant of the intolerant\". Compassion, tolerance and open-mindedness need constant protection, and it's up to those of us who believe in them to shout down the people who would ostracize, oppress or slander others based on their beliefs (or whatever).
So yeah. I support the continuation of this story because I refuse to support, in word dollar or deed, intolerant businesses -- I think that's what a lot of us are here for, and we should be proud of that -- and I am never, ever going to sit down and shut up about it. Every intolerant bigot out there, claiming to be Christian or not, has me and my college degree to contend with for the rest of my life. HA!
@marsneedsrabbits: I do agree that they ought not to do that, and in the end they would have to answer for it. What I dont agree with is utter hatred for all things \"religous\"... and those that wield a banstick to threaten and puff themselves up.
@Alex Chasick: well mr. bloglodite, please tell me the 'stache is real. It is Mustache May for at least one more day now. I've added you to my friends list so please tell me who I have to sleep with to get a real star?
I live in an area where there are quite a few really loud obnoxious fundamentalist type christians/churches/organizations. The scream, protest, bang on doors and harass people and businesses who don't join their little club. The reality is that the majority of the population around here is moderate sane Christian or agnostic/deist leaning. It is just that the wacky fundamentalist ones don't have hobbies and spend all of their free time causing trouble.
I have seen more than one business come out with some of this outwardly religious nonsense not even as offensive as the car dealership see their businesses take a big hit because of it.
Now take everything the dealership and their ad guy said and every term used for people not of their ideology (atheists, non believers etc.) now replace that with the \"n\" word and this would have been all over CNN and Ford would have already gotten directly involved. Telling the public that you hate and basically don't want or will give different (less) service to a protected class of people will get your arse in hot water.
I think this needs the Slashdot/Fark/Daily Kos treatment all on the same day. But direct it at Ford.
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Touchy feely liberals offend me with thier PC BS but I never get an appology. Oh yeah, thats right, they dont have to because it isn't thier problem I'm offended, it mine. I never appologize to anyone for anything I say becuase if you get offended, that is YOUR problem, not mine.
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I wonder if Mr Kieffe is working on an Ark with the proceeds of the dealership? I wish these nutjobs would float away...
@Logan26: This commercial may be the result of those very feelings. I know most in the area are tired of the PC BS.
It is funny thought that this commercial was running locally for several months. No complaints in the paper, no boycotts called for, was never pulled from the radio. It got more covereage for a longer period of time over the radio and the first complaints came from blogs.
I got mind control over d-bo. He be like \"shut the fuck up\"... I be quiet, but when he leave, I be talkin again.
What fundamentalists forget is that any God who says \"I am the only one, all others are fake\" clearly has an inferiority complex and is obviously having penis-length issues.
Probably a teenage-aged Creator.
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\"we're too worried about the state of your immortal soul to be concerned with your car breaking down\"
true story?
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-74137-100x100.png\")
@edicius: Actually, most of the fundies (at least around me) would NEVER wear a crucifix around their necks. That's too Papist. As a practicing Catholic, I've been told by Pentecostal types that one of the reasons Catholics aren't really saved is our \"fixation\" on the crucifix. Because Jesus has risen, the cross is empty, therefore the crucifix is a rejection of the Resurrection. Say what now?
Catherine Hicks, who played the minister's wife on \"Seventh Heaven,\" is Catholic and wore her own crucifix on the show. They actually had to write it into the show that it had been a gift from a Catholic because viewers initially freaked out about it.
I think a lot of atheists and non-Christians would be surprised if they knew how truly nasty different flavors of Christians are to one another.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-4863-100x100.png\")
@Rippleeffect: I agree with the popular opinion that you're a troll, however, I'm going to take the time to explain rationally and respectfully why I feel that way.
This ad promotes religious intolerance. It implies that if you don't worship the same as the owners of the company you're somehow less entitled to the same treatment as those who do follow their system of belief. Freedom of religion is one of the things that's supposed to make this country great, however, while it may be a guaranteed right, it's not always a publicly supported one. These dealers might be nice to you personally when you go to buy a car from them but that doesn't mean that they treat everyone that way. In fact, I'd say it's likely, based on this ad campaign, that at least a few dark-skinned customers from across the globe get treated poorly. Try, for a moment, to put yourself in their shoes. How would you feel if you got talked down to and persecuted for being Christian?
So why does all this offend me over here in NJ? Because it belittles us as a nation, and as a species to have narrow minded fools spend more than their fifteen minutes in the spotlight simply for being narrow minded fools. The rest of the world looks down on us as gun toting narrow minded cowboys, and guys like these dealers are precisely why.
By coming on here and defending them just because you had a positive experience with them is the same as coming on here and saying religious intolerance and persecution are ok. Why would you do that?
1. Only Touchy feely libs care about what others think, hence the reason they developed PC BS to begin with
2. I said it once, I'll say it again, the only people wiht an issue here are those offended. They have several choices at their disposal to included, ignore the comments, change the station and not do business with that company.
3. They are persucuting anything, they are simply saying to others out there, please shut the hell up, we dont care what you believe.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-126486-100x100.png\")
I'm an agnostic, and I don't see why anyone should be offended. I appreciate the fact that I now know not to buy from them. I'm glad they put all their cards on the table.
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Let the market sort it out. It will either hurt, help, or have no effect on their business. Likewise it will affect Ford's image, and may result in Ford taking action. They tried a marketing ploy, and will lose/win accordingly.
Afterthought...
That Georgetown sticker on the car is perfect.
Damn Hoyas...
:P
@Logan26: To represent a name like Ford, you don't have the option of saying we don't care what you believe. Hence the reason they bowed down to corporate and issued an apology. I'll be interested to see how Ford reacts to this however. If it was Joe Schmo's used cars, that's one thing. But I don't think the people over at Ford share the same sentiment as these douches.
@Logan26: For both personal and business purposes I deal with people around the globe. Many MANY of them have a very negative impression of us as a nation. It's never personally directed at me, however, the sentiment is there. As a child, I heard a lot from my parents and teachers about how wonderful this country is only to grow up and find we rank remarkably low in most academic areas, and high (among industrialized nations) in poverty and crime. All of that combined with the \"I love God so hard I'll punch anyone who doesn't agree with me\" attitude taken up by guys like these dealers upsets me. Not because I'm liberal - truth be told, I'm a political moderate. I'd rather trust a dem w/ my civil rights, and a rep with my money. I care about these things because I want to be able to take pride in the society I live in.
We're a part of a great big world whether you want to admit it or not. Do we have to like our neighbors? No - but we do have to share a planet with them, which means it'd be great if we could at very least have a mutual respect. That will never happen while we maintain the gun toting cowboy attitude we show to the rest of the world today.
Don't misunderstand me, I have no qualms with Christians, or members of any other religion for that matter. I personally don't subscribe to any specific religion, though I do believe firmly in God. I do, however, feel that our negative image as a nation comes from people who take the tenants of Christianity and distort and mangle them, and as I've said before, that hurts us all.
And yes - this ad is intolerant and offensive. I disagree with you, but I'm certainly not going to tell you to sit down and shut up because you're Christian. You've got the right to believe what you wish, as does everyone else, without being put down for it.
who cares?
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-406930-100x100.png\")
Oh my... like it or not this guy has every right to spew his own brand of narrow-minded religious fanaticism. It's intolerant filth and if it really does appeal to the community demographic in this area of CA I sincerely feel sad for them. I can only imagine what other ads the dealership will have in store after the recent victory for gay rights.
and I completely agree with you, WhatTheGeek:
@What The Geek: Because it belittles us as a nation, and as a species to have narrow minded fools spend more than their fifteen minutes in the spotlight simply for being narrow minded fools.
The thing that offends me is how he refers to us as \"blog-lo-dites\". Do they think they are better than us bloggers too? They in so many words called bloggers left winged liberals who started this whole mountian from a molehill.
If a McDonalds franchise owner in you area made this same commercial, only condeming christians, I bet you wouldn't hear us libs (or whatever your stereotyping us for) tell you to just eat at a different McDonalds and get over it.
i hope a Muslim suicide bombs there dealership
![\"user-pic\"](\"/mt-static/support/assets_c/userpics/userpic-321187-100x100.png\")
@marsneedsrabbits, these bozos aren't any more Christian than I am. I'm sure you know Jesus's admonition that not all who call \"Lord, Lord\" are truly his followers. No worries, apology or no apology, they'll get theirs in the end, eh?
And what everyone else said about Bakersfield. Atlanta, Georgia is more liberal than many parts of California.
@snoop-blog: why do you care so much?
are there no real news stories or pressing matters going on in the world?
it fascinates me.
I don't know how many people have actually driven by this dealership, but its way out in the middle of the desert, and the next town is 15 miles away. The sign coming into Mojave has a quote from the bible on it. I was coming home from a dig and stopped into one of the fast food resturants (I think it was a Carls Jr. ) and we were sitting eating our food and a church group came in and sang for the people in the resturant (religious songs naturally)..it is just the nature of the area. I alwasy thought that it was a little weird having a dealership in such a small town. just my two cents. :)
@nedzeppelin: I'm at work for another hour and then I could care less. Besides I'm bouncing back and fourth between here and wonkette. Believe me, I'd rather be selling a car. Ironically I work at a car lot.
I'd buy a Ford from this dealership vs. all the other hippies that have overrun the People's Republic of California.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-252038-100x100.png\")
Man O Man! THIS just keeps getting better & better!!!
It's almost like they WANT to drive away all their business. Wow.
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-25310-100x100.png\")
Frankly, I wish more companies would be gutsy enough to spew this kind of bullshit. I'd love to know of all the places that I don't want to spend money. It's so much easier to boycott crazy when it's in such technicolor.
To the people saying it's giving them free advertising:
How so? Sure the name is getting out, but seeing these people carry on like assholes? Does that make anyone want to buy a car from them?
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-387761-100x100.png\")
@pine22: this whole \"Christian\" car dealership thing just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. what the hell does selling cars have anything to do with religion?
Denying peak oil has passed.
Denying global warming.
Denying environmental damage and air pollution.
Rationalizing war on muslim countries to enable theft of their oil (i.e. the \"deal\" the US signed this week to permanently annex Iraq).
That's what it has to do with religion.
Thank goodness I am an Agnostic because, \"Frankly my dear I don't give a damn...about religion that is.\" It has to be exhausting being so sanctimonious all the time telling people what to believe in. Can't even fight a war without it being about religion. Can't go to school without it being about religion. Can't decide for yourself whether you want a child unless it is about religion. Can't wear clothes, eat certain foods, wear certain hairstyles, speak certain words, hell you can't even sell a car without wrapping it around religion.
Man, I am exhausted for you just thinking about all the religion you have to factor into your daily life. How do people get anything done? I'm just curious...are there any decisions left that a grown adult can make for himself that don't require a sanction by the Pope, Allah, Jehovah, Buddha, John Smith, etc?
I wish I could say I am being facetious but I'm not. It just would be nice if people would keep their private choices private and stop thrusting them out into the public. I no more care about who or what you believe in than I do about the type of ice cream you like. I would just like to buy a car without a dealership taking my heathen soul into consideration. I would rather him take into consideration the value of my trade-in.
So this rude bigot is also a liar? Wow. Jesus must be proud!
![\"user-pic\"](\"http://consumerist.com/assets_c/userpics/userpic-328859-100x100.png\")
How embarassing for him, that no one as of yet has sat him down and explained that evolution is provable, like gravity or where sunlight is coming from.
I always find it amusing when Christian Right Wing-nuts say things like \"touchy-feely liberals\" and all that nonsense. Here Logan, here is the truth, given to me by the revelatory power of the Flying Spaghetti Monster:
If it was Christians who were being discriminated against, we would care. If it were Muslims, we would care. Black, Yellow, Purple, Brown, or Paisly, we would care.
And that, my friend, is why we are better people than you.
I don't know what kind of franchise agreement Ford has with this fool but they need to shut him up or cut him loose. Ford is having a difficult enough time as it is selling automobiles and they do not need any bad publicity on top of it to make matters worse for them.
Ford said that its SUV sales declined 36 percent in April compared with the comparable month last year and that its overall sales fell 12 percent.
Ford Motor Co., which dropped its goal of becoming profitable by 2009 and said it will cut production of trucks and sport utility vehicles through the rest of this year. It was a warning shot to the rest of the beleaguered U.S. auto industry, which is facing its worst sales in more than a decade.Ford said it will cut North American production by 15 percent in the second quarter, 15 to 20 percent in the third quarter and 2 to 8 percent in the fourth quarter.
\"We all would like the basic business environment to not have deteriorated, but clearly the most important thing we can do for the long-term success of the Ford Motor Company is deal with this reality,\" Ford President and Chief Executive Alan Mulally said in a conference call Thursday.
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@Logan26: \"They are persucuting anything, they are simply saying to others out there, please shut the hell up, we dont care what you believe.\"
While at the same time going on a rant about how they are subject to persecution that is pretty much imaginary at best.
They need to \"shut the hell up\". After all, they are part of the \"silent majority\", maybe they should pay attention to the first part of that. Kieffe also might want to read up on that whole part about honesty in his professed faith as well with regards to his fake apology, which was a nice example of him wanting his cake and eating it as well. If they were not playing people as fools, he would have valiantly stood up to Ford with the same vigor as his strawmen and refused to apologise.
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Was it HL Mencken who said two of the most horrifying words in the English Language are \"Christian Businessman\"?
Then again, I was really shocked when in the course of business I met a person who got tangled up with Primerica, which was \"Christian\" and yet tucked up with Travelers and Citi.
@Rippleeffect: \"Do you have any proof of this claim?\" He doesn't need proof. He has faith that you are a troll. I think Jesus told him. Personally.
@Rippleeffect: I don't want to jump on the bandwagon here, but I had to ask the question:
\"imo, this was a smart advertising move considering the local people here. Mostly Christian, conservative, and republican, and they mostly advertise on the local country station (typically more christian listeners than other genres) I can't really see that people locally were offended.\"
So if most of the local populace were KKK members, would it have been OK for them to put out an ad saying \"we don't serve them uppity n****rs\"? Or, if it's a mostly male community for them to say \"women should just sit down and shut up\"?
It doesn't matter who your target audience is, this is the age of communication and the internet. Any message you put out, good or bad, is going to reach farther than you realise. If your message is inherently offensive (and that ad was, to atheists and non-Christian theists alike), you should be prepared for a reaction and to make an apology if people are offended. Especially when, as in this case, you're as much a representative of a multinational business as for your own franchise.
Whether or not they were intended to cause offense, and whether or not people in the \"target area\" were offended, people were indeed still offended. This kind of behaviour casts a bad light on Ford, who may actually lose business in other areas of the country (or other parts of the world) if people get the idea that these comments are supported by the company. Yet, Kieffe can't even make a simple apology stick.
(Apologies in advance for any offense I may have caused...)
@Logan26: \"They are persucuting anything, they are simply saying to others out there, please shut the hell up, we dont care what you believe.\"
Yet, people who are not Christians in America have to listen to constant rantings about what *you* believe. They have as much right to say \"we don't care what you believe, why should we be the ones to shut up?\" as you do. Even many Christians are tired of hearing of some of the stuff that members of the faith say in their name.
@snoop-blog: Hey, differing opinions are cool, but I just had to reply to say, amusedly, that I saw your reply just as the \"freezing air comes down from the stratosphere and hits NY\" scene came up in Day After Tomorrow...
Sadly, my last statement is true. You're a car dealership and lose your franchise, you're screwed. Ford isn't exactly in need of more dealers right now...
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Funny how he references the troglodyte, one of the early creatures from which much of the animal world _evolved_. Do you think he gets the irony here? Of course, he probably things that species is only 7000 years old or something.
Also, I have to think that Georgetown bumper sticker is a leftover from a previous car owner, as it's difficult to imagine one of these ID idiots being accepted to a prestigious university.
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@Glamourdammerung: \"While at the same time going on a rant about how they are subject to persecution that is pretty much imaginary at best.\"
LOL. I forbid exactly two behaviors in my comparative religions class, right in the syllabus: If you're a Christian, you don't get to whine about being a member of an \"oppressed\" supermajority. And if you're a non-Christian, you don't get to toss off casual bigotry about Christians just because it's culturally okay to hate on the supermajority. Both attitudes annoy the ever-living SHIT out of me.
Some of my students have very little to say when they're not allowed to complain about the horrific oppression they suffer as a supermajority. :P
@AtomicPlayboy: \"as it's difficult to imagine one of these ID idiots being accepted to a prestigious university\"
I knew a full-out creationist at Duke Med.
---
The one thing I tell myself to comfort me in the midst of this idiocy is that at least they're putting it on the radio -- I'm in favor of bigots being public bigots so I know who to avoid and disdain and what exactly we still have to fight against to wipe out this kind of crap. Just like I'm in favor of NAMBLA because I think ALL felons should join clubs stating their intent to commit felonies. It makes it so much easier for the rest of us. :P
I have to say Ford should consider yanking the franchise not because of the offensive behavior or the creationist vs. evolutionist issue, but the sheer stupidity of a dealership going so far out of its way to arrogantly insult a significant portion of its customer base.
Then, the dealership violated the First Law of Holes - when you're in one, quit digging. They're too stupid (or is it arrogant?) to issue a sincere apology.
Morons.
Perhaps they need to put the following on the California border so outgoing traffic can see it... \"Leaving California. Resume normal behavior\". j/k
@Eyebrows McGee: If loving Marlon Brando is a felony you'd better lock me up and throw away the key.
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@Rippleeffect: I'm going to guess you work for them or are a troll, considering you've only ever posted to this entry.
I will make sure to evaluate your comments based on this information.
I feel compelled to ask that you stop running stories that make me want to leave the country.
I'm sure that Fat Redneck Chickenboy wouldn't care if I did, either, and that's fine with me. Y'all can keep the backwater birdbrains.
@joellevand: This makes no sense to me. I have to register at some point, and comment on an article at some point. I just happened to have a comment and viewpoint associated with what I read here. I see no reason to make that association and call someone else a troll because they have a different viewpoint than the majority of people here.
If you guys want to sit and vent over things, that's fine. I wont stop you, but I won't accept the crap that's being tossed my way because I said it seemed that people were getting upset over something silly. The blatent attacks directed my way for stating my very own opinion (which everyone one here is doing now anyway), are just disheartening, and seem to only validate my feelings that these boards are just laced with hate for opposing views.
Ban me if you wish, but i've yet to personally attack a single person here, but have taken a lot of trash from just about everyone, save for a couple of persons. This just seems to be a very infriendly site to visit.
I will say this outright. I do not work for the dealership, or any dealership. I am not trolling, but giving an opinion just like everyone else here is. I created an account after reading this blog for several months because I felt that there was something I felt like saying. I have heard the actual commercial on the radio. I drive by the dealer everyday. I have found no opinion columns written in the local paper. I have heard no conversations by local people that have heard the actual commercial. Believe me, the people I work with voice their opinions when something upsets them. This is info that I have, that other's did not, and I'm sorry if it has offended people stating as such. Seems to me that in general people are quick to be offended, but rarely appologize when they offend others. In my mind, it makes those here that are spewwing hate no better than those at the dealer they hate so much.
From past experience, I know that nothing I say here will change people's mind about who I am, or claim to me. To those, I'm sorry.
And to Joellevand; I have in fact posted in a thread other than this one, before you actually posted your's. (Granted it was only today) Please do research before you accuse me.
To the Mods, ban me if you must. I will not add anything else to this thread, or answer any personal whispers by others on this matter. I can not sit by and just take the abuse on a blog that I frequently read several times a day at the office. As far as I'm concerned, I'm done with the intollerance
I seem to remember that I called this.
The wording of the apology made it absolutely clear that they weren't in any way, shape, or form apologizing for the ad's message.
On the plus side, I respect Ford more. I'm still going to tell people not to buy Ford vehicles until they pull this joker's license.
As I've stated before, their advertisement is no different than having them say that jews, blacks, gays, muslims, or any other minority should \"sit down and shut up.\"
If you support the business, you support that business's messages.
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Why am I not surprised that it's a Georgetown student that owns the Creationist Celibacy Car?
No casual bigotry about Christians here. Evangelicals can DIAF, however, because they're the ones who stir up hate like this.
It really isn't difficult to liken them to the insane mullahs who run M.E. theocracies.
Sayeth Rippleeffect:
\"Seems to me that a lot of people are just looking for things to be angry about. If you dont like it, don't buy from there. Like they said, sit down and shut up =(\"
Go fuck yourself. Seriously, go fuck yourself. Now, you CANNOT get mad and complain about my saying that, since you didn't HAVE to read it. Just sit down and shut up...after you've fucked yourself, of course. Or are you just looking for something to be angry about?
By the way, 84% of the posters here think you're an asshole, so that means it's OFFICIAL (you know, like what you almost certainly believe about America being a \"Christian nation\" despite all evidence to the contrary).
Rippleeffect, you are so terribly upset by the intolerance of being told to \"sit down and shut up\" while defending some moron doing the same thing? And as far as melodramatically crying about being abused, you should have thought of that before telling people to \"sit down and shut up\".
Any fool crying about \"PC BS\" like you did earlier, then trying to cry about how they are being victimised is pathetic and dishonest to the point of being disgusting. I am terribly sorry you decided to throw crap at people and they told you off. My advice to you is to sit down and shut up.
I've not heard of \"blog-lo-dite\" before, but I have to say, I think bloglodyte is actually quite a nice turn of phrase. I suppose you could deal in stereotypes and trade cave-dwelling for \"places with an internet connection\"-dwelling too if so inclined.
Still, it's probably a successful ad campaign in terms of publicity.
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the hypocrite doesn't even go to a church.
He just wants your money from the people stupid enough to buy his products. It's the same as all those people on TBN asking for dough.
I think some well placed posts about the similarity of \"Kieffe\" to \"keffiya\", and branding these hypocrites a \"muslim terrorist splinter cell\" should shut them up for awhile...
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I don't consider myself an atheist, but this dealership and their ads offend me. They are using religion and God's name to sell cars. Yes, that's very offensive.
Why in the world would anyone want to buy a Ford anyway regardless of who was selling it? Ford and GM make crap.
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You know, this whole 85%/15% thing is a little stupid. The question they asked is something like \"do you believe there is a God\" or even \"there may be a God\", which easily 85% of the population would likely agree with. However, if they turned the question on its head and asked \"do you believe that there might not be a God?\" or \"do you believe that God might not exist?\" the results would be something like 60% saying \"yes\" because now you've got those fence-sitters with their legs hanging over the side you prefer.
This dealership and the people who run it just need to disappear.
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From a business point of view, a firm must do whatever it can to maximize it's shareholder's wealth. If Kieffe & Sons are making more money through this form of advertisement and the exposure over the interwebs, good for them.
However, making money over statements borderlining hate-speech under the guise of \"free speech\" demands immediate action by someone in authority. No matter where you go, there will always be a minority group in every sense and it is the job of the authority figure in a democratic system to protect the rights of the minority.
To be completely, K&S dealerships just strengthen my desire for not purchasing Ford vehicles.
considering Bakersfield was the home of those singing Nazi twins, i'd say this dealership has nothing to worry about.
Look, I said it on the previous article, and I'll say it on this one. If we all send angry emails to Ford, pointing out how \"Religious Intolerance Used Car Sales Guy\" is using the name of their company in his hateful, idiotic commercial, maybe they will pull his franchise agreement or something.
From Ford's website:
Ford Motor Company
Customer Relationship Center
P.O. Box 6248
Dearborn, MI 48126
800-392-3673
I just want to say that I live in the Antelope Valley, and I will NEVER go to Kieffe & Sons now. And I'll be telling all my friends not to, as well (and trust me, boys, I got a lot of friends).
How's that taste, Kieffe?
The soon-to-be-hotties? I think I remember something about them being moved away from the neo-nazis by one of their parents and the other trying to get custody, yadda yadda yadda. I could be wrong, though, and it might be the opposite.
As I commented in the original post, I live in the town where the ads were playing [Ridgecrest, CA on KSSI, iRock].
I listened to the radio all weekend and didn't hear any of the offending ads. I only heard one ad from them that qualified as a decent car dealership ad... it just talked about the cars.
I just fired off another email explaining that his apology was not a very good one and it's obvious he doesn't care about his customers.. which people have come to expect from auto dealers.
I also reminded him that even though he claims to be a Christian, he doesn't seem to be acting like one, and that no one cares about his opinion or beliefs. The only thing we want to hear from him is the deals he's offering on cars. I also informed him that I, nor any of my large extended family and friends will ever buy from his tiny dealerships in their trashy towns. [they really are]
\"The No. 2 U.S. automaker is so far navigating brilliantly through a very dangerous minefield while the fate of its U.S. competitors, General Motors and Chrysler, looks bleaker by the day.\" The Detroit Free Press says, \"While GM and Chrysler quickly asked for bridge loans in order to keep operating, Ford - thanks to a cash pile it built by borrowing back in 2006 before the credit crunch - said it didn't need a rescue. At least not right away.
Wow, I love this statement,$ 20 would have saved two lives in 2006. Ford Motor Company may not need a rescue, but all the people who's houses and cars have burned up sure do! Many people have been 'literally burned alive by defective ford products, and the families that were loyal Ford Motor Company consumers, appear to be the last concern on Ford's list. It goes back to the old saying \" when times get hard you find out who your true friends are\". Ford has not been a very good friend, to me or the other families that have lost loved ones. A Good Friend, or a Good Company would not let the consumer drive around with ticking time bombs under their hood. A good company would own -up to all it's mistakes financial and structural decisions are one thing, human life is another.
What is the price, the worth of my son Payton? The 22 year old young man in his prime, that was so proud to be driving a Lincoln. This American Car Company, turned it's back on this typical all American Young man, by failing to recall the car until 7 months after his being burned beyond recognition. Failing in ever aspect of good Customer Relations ( including Scott Monty on twitter). No flowers, No car-replacement, No payment of funeral cost,and then to have the audacity to deny! To hire attorney's to fight against the families, as if we are the enemy instead of loyal consumers that have lost children. To Ford's navigating brilliantly through a very dangerous minefield statement, I agree Ford Motor Company did navigate brilliantly during the cruise control switch recall,doing it in stages as to not scare off the consumer. Unfortunate for the poor loyal consumer that's car burst into flames because the 'navigator' failed to acknowledge (SCDS bomb) under the hood.
Payton Tyler Lewis 9-9-94 killed 12-9-06 Rest in Peace my son Momma is hear to plea your case and hopefully save some others their lives.
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By the grace of God, this will continue for like, forever, Alex.