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Lemurs
December 0, 0000 12:00 AM
Moderate | Flag for review

Crew rest hours are very serious. The fact that you never heard of them doesn't mean they aren't there or are important. Most people don't know a fraction of the flight safety regulations that are in place. That is one of the biggest ones, since the NTSB and other safety agencies have shown for years that the number one cause of flight accidents are crew error, and the number one factor in crew error is fatigue. Airlines and crew members must take these very seriously, and they do so for your own good.


As for the stuff that happened on the ground in Philadelphia, that's all very strange to say the least. Espcially the pay in cash for fuel part.


Once you got into the airport though, your responsibilities were to make sure that Virgin finished the trip for you, if you want to make them accountable for anything. The second you left the airport to make your own way, you essentially forfeited your rights to any further travel claims on that ticket.


I'll just tell you now that the best you can hope for is some flight coupons. They'll never in a million years issue a refund. You got to your destination, therefore they held up their end of the contract. They did it very poorly, but they did it, so they won't give you squat in terms of real dollars back.


All this from someone who has spent too much time in airplanes and dealing with airlines.

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Lemurs
December 0, 0000 12:00 AM
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BTW, a bit of airline analysis: Diversions from JFK/Newark to Philly are *VERY* common, espcially in the summer months when fast moving severe weather can wreak havoc with the flight schedules at those airports. The idea that Virgin has no history there as a diversion airport is almost impossible to believe.


My guess would be something like this: The ground operations people who are responsible for keeping contracts and accounts up to date in case of emergencies like this screwed up badly at some point in the past, and there was money outstanding at both the airport (landing fees and the like) and with the fuel company. Once that plane hit the ground, no one was in a hurry to help them out, since your deadbeat customers do not get preferential treatment in any business, as far as I know.


Pure speculation on my part, but it's the only reason I can muster as to why any of what the crew said might have happened.

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GenXCub
December 0, 0000 12:00 AM
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Yes, but regardless of the reasons, aren't big companies supposed to have contingencies in place to make sure their customers aren't put through this? Or if they are, that it's minimized as much as possible? Hopefully there will be a follow up when the response from customer service comes back.

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limiter
December 0, 0000 12:00 AM
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Lemurs, if you actually think Amy is at fault then you are an idiot, or a Virgin employee. Virgin has all the responsibility not Amy.



If Virgin employees can't fly anymore they should promptly find a new crew to fly, or purchase tickets on competitor airlines.



If Virgin doesn't provide any further help once a customer ends up at the wrong airport then what are you supposed to do wait there until they do something otherwise forfeit \"any further travel\"? What if they don't show up? Just keep waiting? Stupid.



If Virgin is not even in good enough standing to get fuel on credit then maybe they shouldn't be operating an airline.



Virgin is 100% at fault here, I don't think Amy did anything wrong.

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Falconfire
December 0, 0000 12:00 AM
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Yeah what the hell is up with these Virgin Atlantic appologists? This is casebook study of screwing over the customers here. Even one of these events taking place SHOULD have been grounds for a refund in the past.

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Lemurs
December 0, 0000 12:00 AM
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Having a flight crew sitting around waiting for a diversion isn't something ANYONE does outside their home airports. You don't just hire a bunch of people off the street to fly, and last time I checked, Virgin is an INTERNATIONAL airline, so it's not like they could fly in a crew from London in 10 minutes. They're also not going to rebook an entire flight like that. They do rebookings for missed connecting flights, not diversions to an alternate airport. What some airlines do is arrange for coach-style busses in this situation, but it sounds like Virgin has no or piss poor presence on the ground in Philly.


I'm not apologizing for Virgin, I'm telling you about the realities of flying. You agree to the contract of carriage when you buy the tickets. They are responsible to hold up their end of the bargain which is getting you from point A to point B, and nowhere in that does it say that they're required to get you there ontime or via an exact route. It sucks, I have been on the suck end of it a number of times, but that's the reality of flying.


She isn't at fault for anything, but she also isn't entitled to anything at this point either, other than an apology and a goodwill gesture. It's terrible customer service, and a terrible flying experience, and if they value her business, they'll do something to make it right...but no one has issued refunds for stuff like this since deregulation...and the only reason they could afford to do it then was because they were making money hand over fist at YOUR EXPENSE. Get a grip.

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Ben Popken
December 0, 0000 12:00 AM
Moderate |Flag for review

Will writes:

\"Report it to the FAA… Done it before, cuts right through corporate airline crap.

Watch how quickly they respond to her!!\"

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LLH
December 0, 0000 12:00 AM
Moderate |Flag for review


sorry, longish comment. i used to work for virgin retail in the UK and in the US (the US company is seperate from the UK on and they do suck, the UK one is great to work for though) and yes, i am biased because i really like the airline (company discount and never lost my luggage). virign don't actually have a desk at the philly airport however they code share with continental. you may have been misinformed about who to look for on the ground. but saying that i'm sure they knew they were going to have a problem when they landed at an airport where they don't have any gates. they should have had a customer service rep on the way to deal with everything from the second you stepped off the plane. virgin are most definitely in the wrong. they are a good company, they will make it right. i would call them at the UK office, getting names, don't talk to the first person, get the most high up in the office. then after follow up with a letter, one to the customer service people and one to steve ridgway (ceo). don't go to virgin america. they are a totally seperate company than virgin atlantic. (they are under the same umbrella though). hope that helps.







Telephone Enquiries (USA) (001) 203750 2000

Fax (USA) (001) 203750 6490

Customer Relations (UK) 08704 646 747

Customer Service (UK) customer.services@fly.virgin.com

Main Switchboard (UK) 01293 562 345

Office Address (UK) The Office,

Crawley Business Quarter,

Manor Royal, Crawley,

West Sussex,

RH10 9NU

Office Address (USA) 747 Belden Avenue

Norwalk CT 06850

Connecticut, USA



(from virgin's site)

How to Complain



Virgin.com cannot give you advice on any individual complaints, but the following steps will help you and the appropriate Virgin Company solve the problem as soon as possible.



Make sure you contact the relevant Virgin Group Company. That's the one you bought the product or service from. You can find a complete list of Virgin Group Companies and their contact information by visiting the \"Contact Us\" section.

Always read the terms and conditions for the relevant Virgin Group Company as it may have special arrangements about refunds, guarantees, rights to cancel etc above and beyond the rights given to you by law.

If you think you have a genuine complaint about faulty goods, then stop using the goods immediately. If the complaint is about goods or services, you should contact the Virgin Group Company who sent you the goods or provided the service as soon as possible either by telephoning, emailing or writing.

Explain in as much detail as you can what the problem is and make sure you have all the information to hand e.g. full name and address of the right Virgin Group Company, any customer reference number, details of what you ordered, date when you placed the order, the amount paid, method of payment, receipt number, reason for the complaint and anything else which may be important.

Please note that if any of the prices on any of the Virgin websites are incorrect then you do not have a right to demand to buy the goods at the advertised price. If you do discover an error then please let the relevant Virgin Group Company know so that they can correct any mistakes.



What you can expect from us

If you follow the steps above, we aim to:



Acknowledge all written complaints within 7 days

Respond in full to written complaints within 28 days

Respond to phone calls and email within 48 hours

Listen properly to your feedback and use your suggestions to improve our products and services.

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